Do you think Mueller should be fired?

trysail said:

It's all symptomatic of a severe case of Trump Derangement Syndrome.
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Generic deflection. Not working.
Hell, even Query (pronounced "Quarry") puts in more deflection effort than this.
Time to step up your game, girl.

When the law is against you, argue the facts.

When the facts are against you, argue the law.

When the law and facts are against you, wave your arms and yell.

Trompniks rightly fear what Mueller will present.

Arm-flapping and squawking will increase.

Rightguide said:

Because evidence is emerging that shows the entire Mueller investigation was a frame up, the intention of which was to attack the Trump candidacy and to undermine and destroy the Trump presidency if elected. This is a Faux investigation without a specified criminal charge.

It was based on a dossier falsely fabricated out of lies with the help of Russian Intel actors, paid for by the HRC campaign, and employed by Deep State Obama holdovers to perpetrate a fraud on the FISA Court in order to obtains warrants to spy on the trump Campaign and transition team.

The main motive was the exoneration of Hillary Clinton, ridding themselves of Donald Trump in the event he was elected, and to keep him from appointing people who would occupy high positions of authority that would allow the exposure of past and present corrupt illegal activities of the Obama DOJ, FBI, White House national security personnel, and the corruption of the FISA Court itself.

You don't believe me fine. Wait for Chairman Nunes' report to the nation that is forthcoming. Former federal prosecutor Joseph DiGenova spells it all out here:

https://youtu.be/aa95jLxZfc4

His credentials here:

http://www.digenovatoensing.com/attorneybiosjd.htm

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For each "expert's" opinions you quote, you can find one on the opposing side quoting exactly the opposite opinion. Opinions to me are like assholes, everybody's got one and none of them smell worth a damn.

There is absolutely no evidence that any of this is a fake investigation designed to destroy Trump's presidency and cover for Hillary. That sir is pure speculation and fantasy fabricated from the depths of the minds of those who can't or won't see reality and truth.

The problem I see with your scenario is that Hillary was investigated for Benghazi X 8 by the Republicans and NOTHING chargeable was found. So if we follow your supposed theory they too are part of the "Deep State" and were in on covering for Ms. Clinton.

If on the other hand you believe the Republicans did a thorough investigation, were not trying to frame Hillary and you supported them in that endeavor, then there should be no reason for you to oppose the continued Muller investigation.

Of course there are those who are so blindly partisan, so immersed in the fantasy of "the deep state", so sure that Ms. Clinton has people covering for her through out government, that they will refuse to use sound logical reasoning and will manufacture from pure speculation dubious and irrational "facts" to support what they believe.
for those all I can say is,"there, there it will be over soon".


Comshaw

trysail said:

It's all symptomatic of a severe case of Trump Derangement Syndrome.


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That must be a closely related mental disease to "Hillary Induced Intermittent Explosive Disorder".


Comshaw

If a "deep state" were really against Tromp, he'd never have made it into office. Evidence to prosecute him would have been found or faked long ago. If a "deep state" does exist, it's totally inept, because otherwise you'd never have heard of it. So it's fantasyland. Oy.

No one thought he was going to win. Have you paid attention to the FBI texts?

WoundedKnee said:

No one thought he was going to win. Have you paid attention to the FBI texts?

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I'm going to assume you mean this:

“Are you even going to give out your calendars? Seems kind of depressing,” Page, a FBI lawyer, wrote in the text to Strzok from her FBI-issued phone. “Maybe it should just be the first meeting of the secret society.”

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And since this was reported, has there been any indication of more texts like this or evidence or facts to support the existence of such a secret society? Anyone? Anyone? Or was it a sarcastic joke?

Choose wisely grasshopper.


http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/370711-justice-department-recovers-missing-fbi-agents-text-messages


Comshaw

Aglaopheme said:

If so, then why?

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These investigations, with their unlimited budget, no constraints, was started on the premise of Russian Collusion. Did Trump collude with the Russians to win the Presidency? Ironically, most say Trump didn't want to win....so figure that one out!!

But okay, just investigate Russian Collusion and find evidence on that. Not wander off on some lost trail of forgetting to pay your bill at a restaurant, or ripping the labels off of your pillows. They WILL find something, and I can't wait, but not what they intended it to be and I doubt, anything that impeachable.

Meanwhile, back at the resistance, the economy is going great! Hope the democraps don't mess that up...

Beco said:

These investigations, with their unlimited budget, no constraints, was started on the premise of Russian Collusion. Did Trump collude with the Russians to win the Presidency? Ironically, most say Trump didn't want to win....so figure that one out!!

But okay, just investigate Russian Collusion and find evidence on that. Not wander off on some lost trail of forgetting to pay your bill at a restaurant, or ripping the labels off of your pillows. They WILL find something, and I can't wait, but not what they intended it to be and I doubt, anything that impeachable.

Meanwhile, back at the resistance, the economy is going great! Hope the democraps don't mess that up...

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And that would be nothing like starting an investigation on Benghazi that extended out over 8 separate investigations and years then going off on an e-mail tangent just because you have the money, party majority and time now is it?
Na! Christ on a crutch, what was I thinking! It's good for the goose but not the goosee after all.


Comshaw

Comshaw said:

And that would be nothing like starting an investigation on Benghazi that extended out over 8 separate investigations and years then going off on an e-mail tangent just because you have the money, party majority and time now is it?
Na! Christ on a crutch, what was I thinking! It's good for the goose but not the goosee after all.


Comshaw

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So I assume you're ok with Clinton doing something we regularly send poor people to the slammer for years, ruining and effectively ending any chance for a life after they get out 15-30 years later???

They should just overlook that because they happened upon it while investigating something else??

BotanyBoy said:

So I assume you're ok with Clinton doing something we regularly send poor people to the slammer for years, ruining and effectively ending any chance for a life after they get out 15-30 years later???

They should just overlook that because they happened upon it while investigating something else??

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First off, I can't and won't defend the inclusion of classified material on her private server. That's not mine to do. HOWEVER, even though they (the majority Republican committee) found something, no one (including Hillary) was charged with anything. So are they part of the "Deep State" protecting her, or was there not enough of anything of consequence to charge her with? It's one or the other, choose wisely.

And did I say that I'm Ok with what was found? Did I even imply that? Not at all. What I did do is draw a parallel between what Beco said here and what he has said in the past. Much like many who rabidly support one side or the other do.

Hillary was investigated, it's done. Whether or not you agree with the committee's conclusion is moot. But supporting all lines of investigation in one instance because there might be something to find and later trying to say another one should be limited to investigating only what the original charges were is hypocritical and logically inconsistent.

That being said I will say you are very good at trying to attribute words and ideas to others that were neither spoken or expounded by them. That's a slimy, underhanded political tactic. You really should try a different tack.

Comshaw

Constitutional fact is, no matter the outcome of any femininely emotional, hyperbolic American Idolesque popular vote, the President can legally fire Mueller for any friggin' reason he chooses (just as he did Comey), and no one but Congress can do a constitutional thing about it.

So let me get this shit straight..

Trump thinks about firing Mueller. Then asks the white house council about it and, under the advice of said council, doesn't do anything.

Now can any of you geniuses tell me exactly what law was broken?

Or let's put this another way..

I decide to go knock off a 7-11. After asking my council if that would be a good idea, he says "No". I then decide that knocking off that 7-11 would not be a good idea and do nothing.

What law did I break?

mark_j said:

What law did I break?

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If your plan was to commit robbery in an attempt to cover up or interfere with an investigation into things you may have done previously, it could be Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice. Even if you didn't commit the robbery, you planned to do it.

mark_j said:

What law did I break?

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Quite a few if you have a history of laundering Russian mafiya money.

jaF0 said:

If your plan was to commit robbery in an attempt to cover up or interfere with an investigation into things you may have done previously, it could be Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice. Even if you didn't commit the robbery, you planned to do it.

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There is NO "Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice" that exists constitutionally for ANY President to be charged with by any Special Counsel. It doesn't constitutionally matter WHY any President fires anyone one under her/his command, and NO Special Counsel can charge any President with anything: that power is not legally his, just as Comey had no legal power to decide what was ONLY the Attorney General's to decide.

ALL Meuller can do is report to Congress his FINDINGS - whatever they may be - and then the ONLY negative legal/constitutional outcome for the President would be if any article of impeachment is first brought and then passed against him by a simple majority of the House (218) - THAT CHARGE is the constitutional equivalent of a civilian prosecutor bringing charges against a defendant (again: constitutional power that Special Counsel Mueller in no legal way possesses). Then a two-thirds majority of the Senate (67), the constitutional equivalent to a civilian jury/judge, must vote to convict the President of the articles of impeachment brought against him, thus removing him from Office.

BobBalouski said:

ALL Meuller can do is report to Congress his FINDINGS...

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I suspect Team Mueller shares relevant findings with certain state attorneys general. Violations of state laws can be prosecuted; fines and sentences can be levied. POTUS can't be removed in such cases but punishment can be meted out.

Beco said:

These investigations, with their unlimited budget, no constraints, was started on the premise of Russian Collusion.

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Pretty sure it started out as an investigation into Russian Interference in our electoral process. And counter intelligence. And unlike Trump, Mueller doesn't engage in willful ignorance, so won't turn his head and pretend he doesn't see money laundering, tax evasion, and probably obstruction of justice when it is right under his nose. And don't forget money laundering.

jaF0 said:

If your plan was to commit robbery in an attempt to cover up or interfere with an investigation into things you may have done previously, it could be Conspiracy to Obstruct Justice.

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That's an awful lot of "IF" there sparky.

jaF0 said:

Even if you didn't commit the robbery, you planned to do it.

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So?

Point you are forgetting is that I didn't actually commit any crime. I didn't carry out the plan, nor did I rob the place. Are you seriously advocating that it would be criminal to think?

Do you really want to go there?

Does Minority Report ring a bell? I know it's only a movie but how did that turn out?

So we are rationalizing Trump wanting to fire the man investigating him as okay because him wanting to do so isn't illegal?

Just checking because that's not exactly a strong position to argue. Nor does it reflect well on Trump.

The optics alone are staggering.

ETA... Oh and mcGahn threatening to quit if he did it isn't exactly "under the advice of council, did nothing".

Comshaw said:

First off, I can't and won't defend the inclusion of classified material on her private server. That's not mine to do.

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Fair enough.

Comshaw said:

HOWEVER, even though they (the majority Republican committee) found something, no one (including Hillary) was charged with anything. So are they part of the "Deep State" protecting her, or was there not enough of anything of consequence to charge her with? It's one or the other, choose wisely.

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Oh they found plenty...even the FBI said they busted her red handed but we all know elites don't have to follow the same rules. It was so BLATANTLY bad no less than 3 trials both military and civilian for the SAME shit tried using "but Hillary!" as a defense...every one of them is doing 10-35 years in Leavenworth right now.

It's not one of the other.

When this went down if you remember there was a WHOLE LOT of back door meetings, late night secret rendezvous with AG's and POTUS's on air strips and lots of sweetheart immunity deals being tossed around left and right and it was all the (D)'s could do to keep it under hat and despite their best efforts it looked BAD.

You remember that?

If she got off...that's it....it's over. Doesn't matter what the (R)'s find or have on it today, they can't touch her for it, they would have to find new shit on her.

She won.

Comshaw said:

And did I say that I'm Ok with what was found? Did I even imply that? Not at all. What I did do is draw a parallel between what Beco said here and what he has said in the past. Much like many who rabidly support one side or the other do.

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No but based upon your fevered support for pretty much anything (D)+your comment I figured you might be, that's why I asked.

Comshaw said:

Hillary was investigated, it's done. Whether or not you agree with the committee's conclusion is moot. But supporting all lines of investigation in one instance because there might be something to find and later trying to say another one should be limited to investigating only what the original charges were is hypocritical and logically inconsistent.

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Clearly...because if I had my way she wouldn't be above the law.

And I agree with you on the rest of that.

Comshaw said:

That being said I will say you are very good at trying to attribute words and ideas to others that were neither spoken or expounded by them. That's a slimy, underhanded political tactic. You really should try a different tack.

Comshaw

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That's because I don't actually do it.

I usually ask people something based upon what they said. Usually in an "If you think this then I must assume then XYZ...is that true and if so then XYA?" format.

So I'm not actually trying to attribute words and ideas to others that were never expressed by them as much as I walk them down my thought process to find a "WTF? Esplain. " at the end of it.


Also it's not a slimy underhanded political tactic, it's pretty straightforward argumentation method.

adrina said:

The optics alone are staggering.

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Optics will not be Tromp's concern at some point, like when it's apparent he's bound for prison on state and/or federal charges. He won't care how things appear. He'll care intensely about self-preservation. He won't go down smoothly.

Beco said:

Waste of time, money and they aint got shit....

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Can you post a link to all the information, including all the testimony they've received, that the Muller team is reviewing so that everyone can see that they "ain't got shit"?

Obviously you've seen it all to make such a statement, I'm sure others would like to see it as well. Please share.

Hypoxia said:

Optics will not be Tromp's concern at some point, like when it's apparent he's bound for a tennis court on state and/or federal charges.

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Fixed that for ya. You know 'they' don't go to prison.

I supported the endless non-investigations of Hillary and I support the endless investigation of Trump especially since it is putting an exclamation point on the former while turning up nothing of any great import on behalf of the latter. Mueller seems to be digging a huge mass grave for whom the bell tolls.