Handling an awkward situation

bailadora said:

Harold, your assertion that Amy is not a victim is an out and out falsehood. If being the unwilling object of someone else’s voyeurism were merely a matter of offended sensibilities, there would be no laws against it. But as far as I’m aware, just about every jurisdiction in the US has statutes against Peeping Toms. So you are patently off base and how you even have the guts to suggest otherwise is, quite frankly, mindboggling. As is the contention that an attack need be physical to be categorized as such. But that is a subject for a different thread.

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Perhaps you are right, perhaps Amy is a victim. We have all seen the recent public service announcements regarding domestic violence, and since Amy is either unable or unwilling to protect herself, (she posted: "I'm not sure how to approach this. Should I bring it up or should I ignore it. I think I'm leaning towards ignore because it's not harming anyone"), perhaps you should take the responsibility to see that she is protected. We don't know this young man, and for all we know, his next step may be to rape his mother. It has happened before.

You can contact the authorities in your area and give them all the details about Amy's post/situation, (copy of the post, date, etc). The authorities in your area can then contact Lit and get Amy's Internet Service Provider's location. Then they can forward the details of this sex crime, (as you pointed out, videoing someone naked without their permission is a sex crime), to the proper authorities in Amy's area. The authorities in Amy's area can then, (with a court order/search warrant), confiscate the young man's computer, and if there is a video of his mother in the shower, arrest him and charge him with a sex crime.

If the young man is victimizing his mother, perhaps he should be dealt with harshly. Rapists rarely start out with big crimes; rather, they start with small crimes, then when they get away with it, escalate to bigger crimes. Sex crimes against women today are so common because people ignore the perpetrator when his/her crimes are small by saying, "it's none of my business", then when the crimes are out of control, those same people want to point their finger and cry, "somebody should do something about it." If you believe Amy is a victim of a sex crime, (which apparently she is because that is the point of her original post), then it is your responsibility to file a report with the authorities.

Quote: "I think I'm leaning towards ignore because it's not harming anyone." Not harming anyone? Videoing someone, (anyone), masturbating in the shower without their permission is a crime, and crime harms people.

Why this eagerness to involve "The Authorities"?

The kid has overstepped one of the lines of good behavior.

It is the role of the parents, to help him back inside, and teach him what a closed door means and to respect privacy.

Having him branded as a sex offender is a mad over-reaction, and will haunt him forever. It would be totally out of proportion with the "crime".

Harold_Hill said:

Quote: "I think I'm leaning towards ignore because it's not harming anyone." Not harming anyone? Videoing someone, (anyone), masturbating in the shower without their permission is a crime, and crime harms people.

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Cumference said:

Why this eagerness to involve "The Authorities"?

The kid has overstepped one of the lines of good behavior.

It is the role of the parents, to help him back inside, and teach him what a closed door means and to respect privacy.

Having him branded as a sex offender is a mad over-reaction, and will haunt him forever. It would be totally out of proportion with the "crime".

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Yep. I think Harold's just being contrary here because the argument didn't go his way: "well if you didn't agree with my victim-blaming then logically you ought to do [ridiculous thing] and if you don't do that thing then you're a big ol' hypocrite!"

Perhaps I'm being unfair on him, perhaps I've misread him. But if he really had come around to believing the OP was a victim here, it's hard to see why he wouldn't have apologised for his initial remarks:

Harold_Hill said:

Instead of straightening out your perverted little son, you came here trying to turn yourself into a victim. If you want to know what is wrong with your son, go look in the mirror: *YOU* raised him! Whether you intended to or not, he is what you raised him, (or didn't raise him), to be. You're not a victim, just a poor parent, and I don't have any sympathy for poor parenting.

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So I tend to think he's being a big ol' hypocrite here for the sake of scoring Internet Debating Points.

The other thing that's concerning me with this situation is 'how did he learn how to do this?'

Has he fallen in with a bad crowd online?

.........

GrrlFriday said:

The other thing that's concerning me with this situation is 'how did he learn how to do this?'

Has he fallen in with a bad crowd online?

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Or maybe he has just been watching youtube?

It is full of videos of bathroom pranks. Maybe the hair dryer was full of talc, and he got more on tape than he anticipated?
http://youtu.be/mRvNxDrfN8E
http://youtu.be/5RDO3rDRp1w

Well I talked to my son. I told him that I saw the video, and I found it to be an incredible violation of trust and privacy. I told him this was a really poor choice of judgment and asked him what made him think it was OK. He was very apologetic, and he said he really didn't mean to upset me. He told me that I've been his sexual fantasy for a while now. He said his friends always talk about how hot I am, and that even though he felt the same way it was upsetting for him to have to hide those feelings. And he said that after a while he got frustrated and wanted to see if maybe I was interested if I knew he felt that way.

I was actually shocked that he didn't seem that embarrassed and was instead upfront with his feelings. I told him that I am aware that he's not the only person out there who harbors these types of feelings, but it's wrong and I have no interest in that kind of relationship. He buried his head when he heard this. I told him I really don't think it's healthy, and that he should really work on not feeling that way about me. He responded with, “I'll try.” (Wasn't very convincing.)

Demanded him to hand the camera, and I asked if he had any other videos or if anyone else has seen them. He told me no, the video was just for him and for me to notice.

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

Also because I'd have to type “I've been his sexual fantasy.”

@townieamy, Harold wasn't the only one who wondered about your son's motivations but he was certainly the loudest voice suggesting that you were somehow complicit in your son's actions. This hardly vindicates his thinking that.

It seems like it might be time to look for a therapist to give your son an experienced listener and who might be able to help him get rid of this fixation. I doubt if anyone can do such a thing alone.

Someone posted that that's how it goes.

Support his honesty and probably get him counseling, in a positive and helpful way.

ETA: Guess it was Harold who noted it.

Angie

townieamy said:

Well I talked to my son. I told him that I saw the video, and I found it to be an incredible violation of trust and privacy. I told him this was a really poor choice of judgment and asked him what made him think it was OK. He was very apologetic, and he said he really didn't mean to upset me. He told me that I've been his sexual fantasy for a while now.

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Thanks for sharing.
I think you did the right thing.

He is in a storm of hormones at that age, and some of them may act funny.

Love him as a mother should, and help him outgrow it.

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

Also because I'd have to type “I've been his sexual fantasy.”

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Just because Harold has acted like an (insert any of the charming adjectives used previously) it does not mean, that he can't read and make an educated guess.

But we all have fantasies. Some of them are not acceptable, and in other cases, the "object of desire" is not interested in sharing them, and we will have to leave them again.

townieamy said:

Well I talked to my son. I told him that I saw the video, and I found it to be an incredible violation of trust and privacy. I told him this was a really poor choice of judgment and asked him what made him think it was OK. He was very apologetic, and he said he really didn't mean to upset me. He told me that I've been his sexual fantasy for a while now. He said his friends always talk about how hot I am, and that even though he felt the same way it was upsetting for him to have to hide those feelings. And he said that after a while he got frustrated and wanted to see if maybe I was interested if I knew he felt that way.

I was actually shocked that he didn't seem that embarrassed and was instead upfront with his feelings. I told him that I am aware that he's not the only person out there who harbors these types of feelings, but it's wrong and I have no interest in that kind of relationship. He buried his head when he heard this. I told him I really don't think it's healthy, and that he should really work on not feeling that way about me. He responded with, “I'll try.” (Wasn't very convincing.)

Demanded him to hand the camera, and I asked if he had any other videos or if anyone else has seen them. He told me no, the video was just for him and for me to notice.

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

Also because I'd have to type “I've been his sexual fantasy.”

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You did the right thing in confronting your son. And taking the video and camera was the correct thing to do. Midwestyankee suggested taking him to a therapist. I think a therapist may be of benefit, not for your son, but rather for you. This doesn't mean that I think there is something wrong with you mentally or morally, but I think sometimes we are too quick to turn our children over to other people to deal with problems we should deal with ourselves. A therapist who deals with these situations daily can make suggestions that you or I would never think of, and being the case, could help make your situation much easier to deal with.

Something triggered this behavior in your son. I don't think it was something you did intentionally, but something you are doing inadvertently. Through our body language and mannerisms, we act differently to different people. For example: if you were to meet a man to whom you are attracted, you would act one way, but if you met a man who repulsed you, you would act very differently.

There is nothing wrong with being sexy around young men. If the young clerk at the store thinks you're hot, (and flirts a little), there's nothing wrong with that. That can make a woman feel very good, but this is your son and his friends, and they need to see you as an authority figure, a parent. Peers have a very strong influence when it comes to teenagers. When your son hears his friends saying how hot his mom is, he starts to look himself. And it is very easy for a young man to start thinking of his mother the wrong way.

This is really not as uncommon as you might think, I see a lot of posts on Lit from young men, (and sometimes not so young men), who start seeing their mother as a sexually attractive woman rather than as a parent. This is not a situation that can't be overcome. When your son was a toddler, you had no problem correcting bad behavior, and now that he is grown, you are still his parent, and still have to deal with his bad behavior, (if and when it occurs), you just have to approach it differently. When your son was a toddler, the solution to bad behavior was direct, (sometimes a scowl, sometimes a swat on the bottom), but now that he is grown, the solution has to be more indirect, (more psychological).

If a therapist isn't a good option for you, there is plenty of literature on this subject. (Books, articles, etc) By confronting your son, you have made a good start, and now all you need to do is educate yourself as to how to handle/correct this situation.

Cumference said:

Just because Harold has acted like an (insert any of the charming adjectives used previously) it does not mean, that he can't read and make an educated guess.

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LOL

townieamy said:

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

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Nah. I've seen nothing in this thread to make me think you had any responsibility for this happening, and it sounds like you handled it reasonably. I think one of the tough parts of parenting is the instinct to assume that everything your kid does wrong is your fault; sure parenting's hugely important, but sometimes kids make their own mistakes, especially as they're moving into adulthood.

I don't have any great advice for you at this point but I do want to point out that no matter how many hormones are flowing at his age, from the way you describe his response to the whole thing, your son has some major issues that can't just be swept under the table. It's not a case of you caught him, he's embarrassed, boys will be boys, and will never do this again. Severe trouble is in the future unless he gets some kind of a course correction. It's not just going to happen by itself. I don't remember you talking about a husband or a father but I would be really curious as to what they think of the whole situation. If I were you I would talk to a shrink yourself and get their best advice on how to handle the situation. This has all the earmarks of something terrible happening in the future to someone and he finally gets caught, makes the news, and then everyone says there were signs all along the way that were missed.

there's only one thing left to do....post the video....

Well, good for confronting him, and it's out in the open. However, I would still recommend a followup. You should go to counseling with him, either together or separately. But, this can fester in your relationship with him, and his feelings aren't going away on their own, and him burying his head means he's upset that its not going to happen.

That should be addressed and professional help is key.

townieamy said:

Well I talked to my son. I told him that I saw the video, and I found it to be an incredible violation of trust and privacy. I told him this was a really poor choice of judgment and asked him what made him think it was OK. He was very apologetic, and he said he really didn't mean to upset me. He told me that I've been his sexual fantasy for a while now. He said his friends always talk about how hot I am, and that even though he felt the same way it was upsetting for him to have to hide those feelings. And he said that after a while he got frustrated and wanted to see if maybe I was interested if I knew he felt that way.

I was actually shocked that he didn't seem that embarrassed and was instead upfront with his feelings. I told him that I am aware that he's not the only person out there who harbors these types of feelings, but it's wrong and I have no interest in that kind of relationship. He buried his head when he heard this. I told him I really don't think it's healthy, and that he should really work on not feeling that way about me. He responded with, “I'll try.” (Wasn't very convincing.)

Demanded him to hand the camera, and I asked if he had any other videos or if anyone else has seen them. He told me no, the video was just for him and for me to notice.

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

Also because I'd have to type “I've been his sexual fantasy.”

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subwannabe said:

I don't remember you talking about a husband or a father but I would be really curious as to what they think of the whole situation.

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My first thought was that the father/husband should be involved; however, I have been rethinking that thought. Depending on the personality of the father, (particularly if he is the jealous type with a quick temper), he might see this very differently than Amy. He might see this as his son is competing for his wife's affections sexually, and this could cause more problems than it solves. Amy is the only one who can make that decision, (to tell the father or not), but maybe it would be better for all involved if Amy handled this herself without the father/husband knowing.

Just a thought.

townieamy said:

Let me start out by saying I know it's a big fetish here, but I have NO interest in a incestuous relationship.

The other day I was cleaning up my son's room, and his laptop screen was on. There was a folder left open with a video file that said "mom." I open it up to see it's a video of me getting into the shower. We also have a clear door instead of a curtain, so at one point in the video you can see me pleasuring myself.

This is very weird to me, and I'm not sure how to approach this. Should I bring it up or should I ignore it. I can't imagine how difficult that conversation will be and how embarrassed he will be to have it. I think I'm leaning towards ignore because it's not harming anyone, and I think it's something an 18 year old boy will get over.

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Man, it's posts like yours that solidify my decision not to spawn any little darlings of my own. Thank you.

good ending?

amy, i am so happy for you that you were able to talk with your son and work out his feelings. as i said before, it is not unusual for boys to have sexual feelings about their moms, but it is wrong on every level to do what he did with his camera and to record you. he seems to understand that. i hope that you will be able to have a good relationship with him as he continues on through school and into a career.

the important thing is that he must understand the serious violation of your privacy, the serious legal implications of what he did, and that he will never ever do anything similar to this again. if in fact he understands this, then in the long run it was a good, albeit painful, lesson for him to have learned.

once again, do not even give the dignity of a passing thought to anyone who in any way tries to blame you for what he felt or what he did. you did absolutely nothing wrong, you sound like a good caring parent, and you have dealt with this situation in the best way that you possibly could.

good luck to both of you in the future.
sam

p.s. my two kids are 36 and 33 and it doesn't get any easier. wanna trade?
just kidding.
sam

Felix_Jones said:

Man, it's posts like yours that solidify my decision not to spawn any little darlings of my own. Thank you.

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Believe me, there is also a lot of fun to having kids.

It has been tough at times, but I've never regretted it.

townieamy said:

Well I talked to my son. I told him that I saw the video, and I found it to be an incredible violation of trust and privacy. I told him this was a really poor choice of judgment and asked him what made him think it was OK. He was very apologetic, and he said he really didn't mean to upset me. He told me that I've been his sexual fantasy for a while now. He said his friends always talk about how hot I am, and that even though he felt the same way it was upsetting for him to have to hide those feelings. And he said that after a while he got frustrated and wanted to see if maybe I was interested if I knew he felt that way.

I was actually shocked that he didn't seem that embarrassed and was instead upfront with his feelings. I told him that I am aware that he's not the only person out there who harbors these types of feelings, but it's wrong and I have no interest in that kind of relationship. He buried his head when he heard this. I told him I really don't think it's healthy, and that he should really work on not feeling that way about me. He responded with, “I'll try.” (Wasn't very convincing.)

Demanded him to hand the camera, and I asked if he had any other videos or if anyone else has seen them. He told me no, the video was just for him and for me to notice.

I was hesitant to share this because I feel like because Harold was right that he did this to gauge my interest that it somehow vindicates everything else he said.

Also because I'd have to type “I've been his sexual fantasy.”

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I think you handled it really well. I'm a divorced father and pretty sure if this were to happen in my situation it would be handed over to Dad to handle. A spirited conversation and the brutal destruction of some electronics may have been a route taken, But that wouldn't have been as productive as the conversation you two shared.

Well done

Take away his computer and make sure your son understands he crossed boundries. As far as that jackass Harold Hill implying it was your fault, ignore the sum bitch. You have a right to privacy and to pleasure yourself in your own shower. That is just my opinion of course.

Cumference said:

Believe me, there is also a lot of fun to having kids.

It has been tough at times, but I've never regretted it.

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I'm at an age where the danger of actually having any is rapidly approaching nil. I'll have to keep the guard up a little longer, but I'm starting to relax.

Texas_Mom said:

Take away his computer and make sure your son understands he crossed boundries. As far as that jackass Harold Hill implying it was your fault, ignore the sum bitch. You have a right to privacy and to pleasure yourself in your own shower. That is just my opinion of course.

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You know, perhaps you are right. Perhaps we should turn everybody into a victim so we can all sit around and feel sorry for ourselves. (That's sarcasm in case you don't get it!) Try to get a grip on reality!!!!! She is a parent, and what her son does is her responsibility. Unless you are one of these liberals that let other people raise their children. In that case, you're just a loser.