"To keep the review thread clean..."

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

When I realized approval from me on a new poem was usually followed immediately by an anonymous one or two vote, I tried disguising my approval a couple of different ways, one of which I used on your most recent poem, as you know. I've concluded voting with no comment is best. I've almost never criticized anyone's poetry, anyway, and anonymous approval in the form of a five vote is just as good as an open five, in reality.

How is a poet to grow if they are never criticized? I've had my fair share and like to think I've improved from it besides which some of the numptys that submit in the name of poetry deserve it!

Originally Posted by serpentwrap

Why does a comment need to have a value assigned? Jeez, aren't we getting a tad anal about this? In fact anon comments ensure a marked avoidance of any personal biases that might cloud judgement. Poetry like most works of art, is an individual's mirror. There was a time when I hated Walt Whitman. As I read more of his, I started appreciating him more. I love Frost for perhaps entirely different reasons than others. Keats appeals to me some days while it could be Eliot or Dryden on other days. Why, if Plath depresses me, I might take to Larkin. Its an individual taste, innit?

Sometimes being pedagogic sounds patronising. The above post sure has traces of both.

But then you guys are real aesthete poets. I'm just a neophyte amateur who likes reading poetry that appeals to my sensibilities and sensitivities. Occasionally I dabble in writing a few as well. Its not always neural, the aural and emotional bonding with a poem may cater to my philistine tastes equally well, thank you very much.

If you so wish, I shall refrain from participating any further. Will just lurk as usual.

But 1201, I really really appreciate your dedication to poetry. And your comments are mostly educative and spot on.

nooooooo lurking allowed you're here now and must take the rough with the smooth like everyone else

[twelveoone]

Originally Posted by serpentwrap

Why does a comment need to have a value assigned? Jeez, aren't we getting a tad anal about this? In fact anon comments ensure a marked avoidance of any personal biases that might cloud judgement. Poetry like most works of art, is an individual's mirror. There was a time when I hated Walt Whitman. As I read more of his, I started appreciating him more. I love Frost for perhaps entirely different reasons than others. Keats appeals to me some days while it could be Eliot or Dryden on other days. Why, if Plath depresses me, I might take to Larkin. Its an individual taste, innit?

Sometimes being pedagogic sounds patronising. The above post sure has traces of both.

But then you guys are real aesthete poets. I'm just a neophyte amateur who likes reading poetry that appeals to my sensibilities and sensitivities. Occasionally I dabble in writing a few as well. Its not always neural, the aural and emotional bonding with a poem may cater to my philistine tastes equally well, thank you very much.

If you so wish, I shall refrain from participating any further. Will just lurk as usual.

But 1201, I really really appreciate your dedication to poetry. And your comments are mostly educative and spot on.

Yes, maybe

But definitely no to:
If you so wish, I shall refrain from participating any further. Will just lurk as usual.

You are who you are, every view is unique, every unique view is a contribution.


Except anon's
Rule 81


I'm just a neophyte amateur who likes reading poetry that appeals to my sensibilities and sensitivities. Occasionally I dabble in writing a few as well

apt description of

me

but not anon44
he's a perv

[theognis]

"How is a poet to grow if they are never criticized? I've had my fair share and like to think I've improved from it besides which some of the numptys that submit in the name of poetry deserve it!"


I find a good deal of the criticism on this board is not constructive, and even that which is constructive is often met with hostility, often from some third party with an axe to grind.

[twelveoone]

Originally Posted by theognis

"How is a poet to grow if they are never criticized? I've had my fair share and like to think I've improved from it besides which some of the numptys that submit in the name of poetry deserve it!"


I find a good deal of the criticism on this board is not constructive, and even that which is constructive is often met with hostility, often from some third party with an axe to grind.

constructive is merely what you take and use.

10 "I love this" means you write more of the same, until they get bored. Meanwhile boring the hell out of the other people that read it.

"this is not quite right" or "you fucked up here" I would hope you would think about it, at least the next time. Maybe, not follow it, but THINK about it.

"this really made me hot" is usually followed by a PM proposition.

anon voting is either one of your fans pressing the button, sometimes twice, or in my case "who in the fuck did I piss off now"

We are all parties with "axes to grind", I try to keep mine sharp, you know I have and it will be in your face. The true Viking way. Axes to grind is a loaded phrase.

anon hides in the bush and uses a blow gun

So yes, the percentage of useful shit would be rather low.

Reading the comments on others, it may be slightly higher, if you THINK about it.

And leaving them. if you THINK about it, is always worthwhile for you.

[theognis]

Originally Posted by twelveoone

constructive is merely what you take and use.

10 "I love this" means you write more of the same, until they get bored. Meanwhile boring the hell out of the other people that read it.

"this is not quite right" or "you fucked up here" I would hope you would think about it, at least the next time. Maybe, not follow it, but THINK about it.

"this really made me hot" is usually followed by a PM proposition.

anon voting is either one of your fans pressing the button, sometimes twice, or in my case "who in the fuck did I piss off now"

We are all parties with "axes to grind", I try to keep mine sharp, you know I have and it will be in your face. The true Viking way. Axes to grind is a loaded phrase.

anon hides in the bush and uses a blow gun

So yes, the percentage of useful shit would be rather low.

Reading the comments on others, it may be slightly higher, if you THINK about it.

And leaving them. if you THINK about it, is always worthwhile for you.

What is the real difference between an anonymous comment and a comment from someone who is also anonymous, but using a nom de plume?

[serpentwrap]

Originally Posted by theognis

What is the real difference between an anonymous comment and a comment from someone who is also anonymous, but using a nom de plume?

Its like a shadow asking its own shadow to hide... :-) {Now thats a theme for a poem, I guess!}

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

"How is a poet to grow if they are never criticized? I've had my fair share and like to think I've improved from it besides which some of the numptys that submit in the name of poetry deserve it!"


I find a good deal of the criticism on this board is not constructive, and even that which is constructive is often met with hostility, often from some third party with an axe to grind.

That's why I blocked my emails because they all come through as being from Anon, my PMs are open you have a beef with me then send it that way but at least it has a name on it

[theognis]

Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell

That's why I blocked my emails because they all come through as being from Anon, my PMs are open you have a beef with me then send it that way but at least it has a name on it

If by "e-mails" you mean instant feedback, that doesn't all come anonymously. I sent you one concerning your latest poem, and signed it. I frequently get feedback that is more often than not signed, usually with return e-mail addresses.

What, if anything, do you have against anonymous comments left on your poems?

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

If by "e-mails" you mean instant feedback, that doesn't all come anonymously. I sent you one concerning your latest poem, and signed it. I frequently get feedback that is more often than not signed, usually with return e-mail addresses.

What, if anything, do you have against anonymous comments left on your poems?

Well I wouldn't have got it as I said I have blocked Lit from my end because I couldn't get it to block on site (so you can send but they don't arrive) and unless you actually put your name in the body of the message they all say from an Anonymous sender anyway. As for why I dislike them on my poems it's probably because the original Anon has spoiled it for all other Anons and I don't take them seriously in case it's a piss take

[theognis]

Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell

Well I wouldn't have got it as I said I have blocked Lit from my end because I couldn't get it to block on site (so you can send but they don't arrive) and unless you actually put your name in the body of the message they all say from an Anonymous sender anyway. As for why I dislike them on my poems it's probably because the original Anon has spoiled it for all other Anons and I don't take them seriously in case it's a piss take

I see. Well, I wrote to tell you I was the anon who commented that your latest poem was perhaps your best. I saw that my comment and five vote was almost immediately followed by another anonymous, and less complimentary, comment and vote that dropped your rating from a 4.80 to a 4.55. The timing may have been pure coincidence, but I think perhaps not.

[theognis]

Enough time elapsed between my vote, which was your tenth, and the next vote for your 'H' to appear. Fortunately, the next vote was a two, not a one, so you still have your 'H', if you even care about that any longer.

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

Enough time elapsed between my vote, which was your tenth, and the next vote for your 'H' to appear. Fortunately, the next vote was a two, not a one, so you still have your 'H', if you even care about that any longer.

It's nice to get them I can't deny but whether they stay for very long is something I can't control so I don't waste time worrying about it and I have my E and that can't be stolen!

oh and thanks for the feedback that didn't arrive thru no fault of yours

[twelveoone]

Originally Posted by theognis

What is the real difference between an anonymous comment and a comment from someone who is also anonymous, but using a nom de plume?

1. what is the difference between walking on two legs or four? (1984)

anything can be subject to more than one interpretation, if a question arises, they can get back to me. If they don't like it they can also retaliate, so it also serves as a limiting factor as to how a comment is phrased.

The name has a degree of credibility (or incredibility).

"S4 is useless"as an example.

I will pay more attention to a comment by Angeline or greenmountaineer.

anon will be dismissed.

"I like this"

I will pay attention if it comes from an opposing camp* than a fan*

anon will be dismissed.

Leaving a nom de plume generally cuts down of some of the crap that this place suffers from by leaving a sort of trail, particularity in regards to voting.

Rule 1201 anon just adds to the stench NO EXCEPTIONS.

in my view 'opposing camps" may be more important than "fans"; prevents stagnation.

Why the hell do you two care? Why are you defending the most proxy of proxies? This anon baiting is (I don't suspect) not directed at you. This bullshit precedes us all, it's time to end it.

In the immortal words of "Perks" (I'll add the link later maybe)

anon you're a fucktard.

The lit. "sweeper" has enough trouble with the alts. Weigh the voting, so an anon vote is worth 1/10 of a nom de plume, you'll see a lot less of the plume de H's.

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

I see. Well, I wrote to tell you I was the anon who commented that your latest poem was perhaps your best. I saw that my comment and five vote was almost immediately followed by another anonymous, and less complimentary, comment and vote that dropped your rating from a 4.80 to a 4.55. The timing may have been pure coincidence, but I think perhaps not.

as a matter of interest how do you know what my ratings are?

[serpentwrap]

Originally Posted by twelveoone

1. what is the difference between walking on two legs or four? (1984)

anything can be subject to more than one interpretation, if a question arises, they can get back to me. If they don't like it they can also retaliate, so it also serves as a limiting factor as to how a comment is phrased.

The name has a degree of credibility (or incredibility).

"S4 is useless"as an example.

I will pay more attention to a comment by Angeline or greenmountaineer.

anon will be dismissed.

"I like this"

I will pay attention if it comes from an opposing camp* than a fan*

anon will be dismissed.

Leaving a nom de plume generally cuts down of some of the crap that this place suffers from by leaving a sort of trail, particularity in regards to voting.

Rule 1201 anon just adds to the stench NO EXCEPTIONS.

in my view 'opposing camps" may be more important than "fans"; prevents stagnation.

Why the hell do you two care? Why are you defending the most proxy of proxies? This anon baiting is (I don't suspect) not directed at you. This bullshit precedes us all, it's time to end it.

In the immortal words of "Perks" (I'll add the link later maybe)

anon you're a fucktard.

The lit. "sweeper" has enough trouble with the alts. Weigh the voting, so an anon vote is worth 1/10 of a nom de plume, you'll see a lot less of the plume de H's.

Why the hell do you two care? Why are you defending the most proxy of proxies? This anon baiting is (I don't suspect) not directed at you. This bullshit precedes us all, it's time to end it.

I guess one of the two you mention is yours truly. Its clear to me that this "anon baiting" has some nasty history to it. Well, I have no clue. I find the discussions here ranging from cerebral, stimulating, irreverent, knowledgeable, uninhibited and plain rubbish too, It interests me. I like reading and discussing poetry; I lurk on many stimulating threads that have provided fascinating insights.

I have no clue about camps, opposing or acquiescing! Frankly, I don't even care. I have more than enough such problems in RL! This camp business stinks of kind of a net parochialism. Till I experience something personally, I will have no such influence or bias thrust upon me.

In the principle of it, I see little wrong in posting a comment anonymously. If the comments are not vicious or bordering on libel, there could also be some merit in it. By your own admission, you would consider a comment by certain posters more seriously than others. Fair enough. The corollary to this logic is that a poster who is not "so well respected" or is a newbie but has valid arguments and experience might want to adopt the anon route for the very reason to be taken seriously. You might think anons are fucktards, others might find some value in the poster's comments. For instance, if you hadn't given the link to Pascal's Wager, it was an anon who had tried to put some perspective to the said wager. And whats wrong if the poster did not want to reveal his/her cyber identity? The comment would remain as valid, and might have helped some others to enjoy greenmountaineer's lovely poem even better. How would a comment like this add to the stench, beats me.

Judge each case on its individual merit or lack of it. Sometimes, spirit of the law is more important than the letter of the law! And if the spirit of anonymous comments is constructive, without malice and honest, it doesn't - and shouldn't - take anything away from the posts. Besides, a family jells best, if individual idiosyncrasies of its members are humnoured, as long as they do not harm anyone else.

By the same logic, I am willing to humour the antagonism of certain posters against anons as individual idiosyncrasies (perhaps with good reason too), but abusing all anons, for reasons that escape the hell out of me, leaves an unsavoury taste.

I think theognis's reason for anonymity deserves some respect. It may be flawed for some of you, but surely even you would agree that its neither ill-intentioned, nor disturbing or harmful or malicious.

No hard feelings, I hope. :-)

[theognis]

Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell

as a matter of interest how do you know what my ratings are?

Do you never look at your own page? It clearly shows the ratings for all your poems. Actually, there are several ways you can find this information, including number of votes. Go to top lists, click poetry, click last thirty days. Your latest poem now has 11 votes and a 4.55 rating. After I voted it had 10 and a 4.80 rating. It's easy to determine the 11th vote was a two.

[theognis]

Originally Posted by serpentwrap

Why the hell do you two care? Why are you defending the most proxy of proxies? This anon baiting is (I don't suspect) not directed at you. This bullshit precedes us all, it's time to end it.

I guess one of the two you mention is yours truly. Its clear to me that this "anon baiting" has some nasty history to it. Well, I have no clue. I find the discussions here ranging from cerebral, stimulating, irreverent, knowledgeable, uninhibited and plain rubbish too, It interests me. I like reading and discussing poetry; I lurk on many stimulating threads that have provided fascinating insights.

I have no clue about camps, opposing or acquiescing! Frankly, I don't even care. I have more than enough such problems in RL! This camp business stinks of kind of a net parochialism. Till I experience something personally, I will have no such influence or bias thrust upon me.

In the principle of it, I see little wrong in posting a comment anonymously. If the comments are not vicious or bordering on libel, there could also be some merit in it. By your own admission, you would consider a comment by certain posters more seriously than others. Fair enough. The corollary to this logic is that a poster who is not "so well respected" or is a newbie but has valid arguments and experience might want to adopt the anon route for the very reason to be taken seriously. You might think anons are fucktards, others might find some value in the poster's comments. For instance, if you hadn't given the link to Pascal's Wager, it was an anon who had tried to put some perspective to the said wager. And whats wrong if the poster did not want to reveal his/her cyber identity? The comment would remain as valid, and might have helped some others to enjoy greenmountaineer's lovely poem even better. How would a comment like this add to the stench, beats me.

Judge each case on its individual merit or lack of it. Sometimes, spirit of the law is more important than the letter of the law! And if the spirit of anonymous comments is constructive, without malice and honest, it doesn't - and shouldn't - take anything away from the posts. Besides, a family jells best, if individual idiosyncrasies of its members are humnoured, as long as they do not harm anyone else.

By the same logic, I am willing to humour the antagonism of certain posters against anons as individual idiosyncrasies (perhaps with good reason too), but abusing all anons, for reasons that escape the hell out of me, leaves an unsavoury taste.

I think theognis's reason for anonymity deserves some respect. It may be flawed for some of you, but surely even you would agree that its neither ill-intentioned, nor disturbing or harmful or malicious.

No hard feelings, I hope. :-)

Like you, I don't see the problem with anonymous comments. There's no difficulty in responding to them, if one wishes.

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by serpentwrap

Why the hell do you two care? Why are you defending the most proxy of proxies? This anon baiting is (I don't suspect) not directed at you. This bullshit precedes us all, it's time to end it.

I guess one of the two you mention is yours truly. Its clear to me that this "anon baiting" has some nasty history to it. Well, I have no clue. I find the discussions here ranging from cerebral, stimulating, irreverent, knowledgeable, uninhibited and plain rubbish too, It interests me. I like reading and discussing poetry; I lurk on many stimulating threads that have provided fascinating insights.

I have no clue about camps, opposing or acquiescing! Frankly, I don't even care. I have more than enough such problems in RL! This camp business stinks of kind of a net parochialism. Till I experience something personally, I will have no such influence or bias thrust upon me.

In the principle of it, I see little wrong in posting a comment anonymously. If the comments are not vicious or bordering on libel, there could also be some merit in it. By your own admission, you would consider a comment by certain posters more seriously than others. Fair enough. The corollary to this logic is that a poster who is not "so well respected" or is a newbie but has valid arguments and experience might want to adopt the anon route for the very reason to be taken seriously. You might think anons are fucktards, others might find some value in the poster's comments. For instance, if you hadn't given the link to Pascal's Wager, it was an anon who had tried to put some perspective to the said wager. And whats wrong if the poster did not want to reveal his/her cyber identity? The comment would remain as valid, and might have helped some others to enjoy greenmountaineer's lovely poem even better. How would a comment like this add to the stench, beats me.

Judge each case on its individual merit or lack of it. Sometimes, spirit of the law is more important than the letter of the law! And if the spirit of anonymous comments is constructive, without malice and honest, it doesn't - and shouldn't - take anything away from the posts. Besides, a family jells best, if individual idiosyncrasies of its members are humnoured, as long as they do not harm anyone else.

By the same logic, I am willing to humour the antagonism of certain posters against anons as individual idiosyncrasies (perhaps with good reason too), but abusing all anons, for reasons that escape the hell out of me, leaves an unsavoury taste.

I think theognis's reason for anonymity deserves some respect. It may be flawed for some of you, but surely even you would agree that its neither ill-intentioned, nor disturbing or harmful or malicious.

No hard feelings, I hope. :-)

Up until just lately practically every Anon comment has been insulting and hurtful, of course you are not to know this but that's the reason the hatred for everything Anonymous lurks on these pages and it's hard to think otherwise on the subject

Originally Posted by theognis

Do you never look at your own page? It clearly shows the ratings for all your poems. Actually, there are several ways you can find this information, including number of votes. Go to top lists, click poetry, click last thirty days. Your latest poem now has 11 votes and a 4.55 rating. After I voted it had 10 and a 4.80 rating. It's easy to determine the 11th vote was a two.

Of course I know how to see this on my own pages though I rarely bother but I've no idea where Top lists are seeing as I don't check my own ratings let alone anyone elses

[theognis]

Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell

Up until just lately practically every Anon comment has been insulting and hurtful, of course you are not to know this but that's the reason the hatred for everything Anonymous lurks on these pages and it's hard to think otherwise on the subject



Of course I know how to see this on my own pages though I rarely bother but I've no idea where Top lists are seeing as I don't check my own ratings let alone anyone elses

If you're interested, go to the Site Contents page. You'll find Top Lists there, and you can check ratings for anything on the site.

[butters]

Originally Posted by theognis

If you're interested, go to the Site Contents page. You'll find Top Lists there, and you can check ratings for anything on the site.

would you be good enough to provide a quickie link, please, theo, since i'm having trouble finding this as well?

[theognis]

Originally Posted by chipbutty

would you be good enough to provide a quickie link, please, theo, since i'm having trouble finding this as well?

http://www.literotica.com/top/

[butters]

Originally Posted by theognis

http://www.literotica.com/top/

cheers

[UnderYourSpell]

Originally Posted by theognis

If you're interested, go to the Site Contents page. You'll find Top Lists there, and you can check ratings for anything on the site.

do you check the rating for every poem or just mine?

[butters]

good lord. what a ton of tripe there, with the odd gem sparkling away amidst the crud.

seems the way to get a top-read listing is to have a pornish title

lauren, jstherra, and one or two others don't rely on that.

nothing wrong with a dirty poem so long as it's a good dirty poem. sigh.

[theognis]

Originally Posted by chipbutty

cheers

Right back at you.