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Old 04-15-2019, 01:40 AM   #26
cascadiabound
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The Dress

Dressmaker dressmaker make me a dress
cobalt blue silk and new lace from London
make it so pretty and sure to impress
bishop sleeves and skirts swirl with abandon

six yards double gauged with fine hand stitches
Tuck’d and pleated bodice so flattering
a dress so fine a mere glance bewitches
a blush, a look, a bit of pampering

ivory comb in my hair, broach at my neck
corset, petticoats and leather shoes too
give me your hand love, I’ll take no raincheck
dark eyes meet hazel our love will renew

darling, pray dance me ‘round the lovely park
twirl me, embrace me until it is dark
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“Life is full of stories. Or maybe life is only stories."
All stories are, in some form, prayers." ~Brian Doyle
"Politeness can be mistaken for flirting because it’s so uncommon."

My belongs to Mr. T
"Some women are made of steel, stones, tears, dust, bones and scars.
Others are made of books, music, rainfall, stardust, moonlight, flowers,
daydreams and wild adventures. The rare ones are made of both." O. Ehixojie
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Old 04-15-2019, 12:22 PM   #27
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Thank to everyone who submitted, I know forms are a challenge to some of us.

As cascadiabound is on the West side of NA, her submission made it in under the timeline, which makes Harry the penultimate contributor. Accordingly he gets to decide where the next challenge goes.

I'm away for a week around Easter but will try to enter.
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Old 04-15-2019, 03:11 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Piscator View Post
Thank to everyone who submitted, I know forms are a challenge to some of us.

As cascadiabound is on the West side of NA, her submission made it in under the timeline, which makes Harry the penultimate contributor. Accordingly he gets to decide where the next challenge goes.

I'm away for a week around Easter but will try to enter.
This was my first sonnet. It was like pulling teeth.
Congratulations to Harry.
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“Life is full of stories. Or maybe life is only stories."
All stories are, in some form, prayers." ~Brian Doyle
"Politeness can be mistaken for flirting because it’s so uncommon."

My belongs to Mr. T
"Some women are made of steel, stones, tears, dust, bones and scars.
Others are made of books, music, rainfall, stardust, moonlight, flowers,
daydreams and wild adventures. The rare ones are made of both." O. Ehixojie
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Old 04-15-2019, 03:20 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascadiabound View Post
This was my first sonnet. It was like pulling teeth.
Congratulations to Harry.
Told you you could and it was a good one too
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Blessed are the cracked for it is they that let in the light
They say a smile is a gift which is free to the giver and precious to the recipient.
But giving the finger is free, too, and I find it more personal and sincere.
If at first you don't succeed....skydiving is not for you ....
If you don't pay your exorcist .... do you get repossessed?
I shall always decide not to decide, unless of course I decide to change my mind.
....But I, being poor, have only my dreams, I have spread my dreams under your feet,Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.......
Nil Caborundum illigitimi
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Annie submits
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Old 04-15-2019, 04:53 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascadiabound View Post
This was my first sonnet. It was like pulling teeth.
Congratulations to Harry.
..
Ty, ty I could have spent/used a little more time on mine but I thought Saturday was Sunday, oh well good job all
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:34 PM   #31
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Where the seagulls cry

Oh where has she gone, my Lady in red
Captured by pirates, sailing fast and far
To hot exotic lands, or so tis said
Past the cries of seagulls and creaks of spars
Over vast oceans and hot foriegn suns
Rainstorms and high seas, my lonesome journey
The tars swab the decks and polish the guns
Preparing perhaps for a seaside tourney
Avoiding my glance, yea, my vengeful glare
These men whisper and wonder on their fate
My crew, bound to me, adventure we share
Anticipating the release of hate
Nay, they do not know, what is in my breast
Only my love for her, with all its zest
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:09 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascadiabound View Post
Dressmaker dressmaker make me a dress
[...]
corset, petticoats and leather shoes too
give me your hand love, I’ll take no raincheck
dark eyes meet hazel our love will renew

darling, pray dance me ‘round the lovely park
[...]
Very nice!

Lines L1-L10 are a bit predictable, then lines L11-L14 are a bit predictable again, and the two parts are not well integrated. You may fix all this by changing just one line. It may induce some miserable people into smiling or into a smirk but don't worry, here it is:
L12: - - - and don't you dare to step on my shoe
Of course, you may device something better -- just get away from routine.

Once again, your sonnet is impressive.

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 01:13 AM. Reason: better
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Old 04-16-2019, 05:59 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by LizVegas79 View Post
Wow! You're all so good at this!
Come and join in, you can do it too
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Blessed are the cracked for it is they that let in the light
They say a smile is a gift which is free to the giver and precious to the recipient.
But giving the finger is free, too, and I find it more personal and sincere.
If at first you don't succeed....skydiving is not for you ....
If you don't pay your exorcist .... do you get repossessed?
I shall always decide not to decide, unless of course I decide to change my mind.
....But I, being poor, have only my dreams, I have spread my dreams under your feet,Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.......
Nil Caborundum illigitimi
Sestina slut
Annie submits
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Old 04-16-2019, 09:09 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Senna Jawa View Post
Very nice!

Lines L1-L10 are a bit predictable, then lines L11-L14 are a bit predictable again, and the two parts are not well integrated. You may fix all this by changing just one line. It may induce some miserable people into smiling or into a smirk but don't worry, here it is:
L12: - - - and don't you dare to step on my shoe
Of course, you may device something better -- just get away from routine.

Once again, your sonnet is impressive.

How do you go from predictable (which my poor simple mind can't comprehend how you see anything as predictable, you got any lotto numbers?) And not well integrated to impressive?

Enlighten us professor.
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Old 04-16-2019, 09:19 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LizVegas79 View Post
Wow! You're all so good at this!


Hiya Liz,

Welcome aboard! I've read a bit of your work here and there. You write well. Looking forward to your creativity here.
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Old 04-16-2019, 12:21 PM   #37
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The Mystery of RED 銀果
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell View Post
Told you you could and it was a good one too
Quote:
Originally Posted by Senna Jawa View Post
Very nice!
[Snip]

Once again, your sonnet is impressive.
Thank you Annie and Senna Jawa.

I will take your thoughts under advisement. I rather like the original line and I don't care for the hectoring feeling of your suggested replacement.
__________________
“Life is full of stories. Or maybe life is only stories."
All stories are, in some form, prayers." ~Brian Doyle
"Politeness can be mistaken for flirting because it’s so uncommon."

My belongs to Mr. T
"Some women are made of steel, stones, tears, dust, bones and scars.
Others are made of books, music, rainfall, stardust, moonlight, flowers,
daydreams and wild adventures. The rare ones are made of both." O. Ehixojie
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Old 04-16-2019, 12:25 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LizVegas79 View Post
Wow! You're all so good at this!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrtenant View Post
Hiya Liz,

Welcome aboard! I've read a bit of your work here and there. You write well. Looking forward to your creativity here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderYourSpell View Post
Come and join in, you can do it too
Hi Liz
Lovely to see you here. Give it a try. If I can write a sonnet you can write something for Harry's next challenge. I am finding just writing more makes every attempt a little easier.
Can't wait to see what you do.
__________________
“Life is full of stories. Or maybe life is only stories."
All stories are, in some form, prayers." ~Brian Doyle
"Politeness can be mistaken for flirting because it’s so uncommon."

My belongs to Mr. T
"Some women are made of steel, stones, tears, dust, bones and scars.
Others are made of books, music, rainfall, stardust, moonlight, flowers,
daydreams and wild adventures. The rare ones are made of both." O. Ehixojie
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:03 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrtenant View Post
How do you go from predictable (which my poor simple mind can't comprehend how you see anything as predictable, you got any lotto numbers?) And not well integrated to impressive?
Poetry has its scope. There is a lot of room in poetry.

Quote:
Enlighten us professor.
(I am just a retarded professor ). I'll answer your questions soon.

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 02:47 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:19 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascadiabound View Post
I rather like the original line
A soldier's wisdom phrase (aphorism):
one guy likes Chopin,
another guy likes it when his feet stink.
Quote:
I don't care for the hectoring feeling of your suggested replacement.
You sound logically confused -- my fault, I guess.

The possible hectoring was just a little side insert which had nothing to do with my suggestion; My "replacement" is about poetry, not about miserable smirking guys who don't know better -- poetry is not about smirking.

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 02:39 PM. Reason: cosmetic
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Old 04-16-2019, 03:42 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrtenant View Post

How do you go from predictable (which my poor simple mind can't comprehend how you see anything as predictable, you got any lotto numbers?) And not well integrated to impressive?

Enlighten us professor.
The cascadiabound sonnet's language is on a high level -- rich, stylish, sophisticated and still natural. This language is also consistent with one minor exception. Actually, inhomogeneity can be often very welcome, but an isolated phrase "I’ll take no raincheck" sticks out and feels to me uncomfortable -- as it is now, it belongs to a different story.


The sonnet's rhymes are very nice. An important, if not the main quality of rhymes, is their unpredictability (for the predictability -- see Frost). In particular, the so-called grammatical rhymes are often too trivial. The other consideration, common to other poetic devices, is the distance between the two involved elements; in the case of rhymes it's simple, the larger the distance the better (granted that otherwise, the text makes sense) Here is the list of the sonnet's rhymes:
  • L1+L3: a dress ---- impress (a noun vs a verb);
  • L2+L4: London ---- abandon (huge distance; specific London and abstract noun abandon which to me sounds almost like a verb or even an adjective);
  • L5+L7:stiches ---- bewitches (a plural noun vs a singular verb);
  • L6+L7:flattering ---- pampering (oh, well... , it's ok)
  • L9-L11:at my neck ---- no raincheck (reasonable distance, 1 negation adds to variety);
  • L10-L12:shoes too ---- renew (an adverb vs a verb);
  • L13-L14:park ---- dark (a noun vs an adjective)
It's far from common to have such rhymes' high quality.


Remark: At a very early Internet year there was an Indian poet on rec.arts.poems whose rhymes were nothing but "...ing". We liked his poetry, he was good. The art is about selecting certain directions and going there to an extreme, it's about perfectness within the chosen domain.

Remark: I've mentioned distance. In the case of rhymes, it's simple. The distance is even more important in the case of simile, metaphor, juxtaposition, and kenning. This time the situation in the mentioned four instances is more involved. The distance cannot be forced, one should never manhandle the poetry. The distance should be impressive but the text must be instantly convincing. The reader should feel AHA! rather than feeling impressed by the author's inventiveness and intelligence (then it's fake).

=======

I have to stop now. I may continue later (or not).

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 07:18 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 04-16-2019, 05:01 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Senna Jawa View Post
The cascadiabound sonnet's language is on a high level -- rich, stylish, sophisticated and still natural. This language is also consistent with one minor exception. Actually, inhomogeneity can be often very welcome, but an isolated phrase "I’ll take no raincheck" sticks out and feels to me uncomfortable -- as it is now, it belongs to a different story.


The sonnet's rhymes are very nice. An important, if not the main quality of rhymes, is their unpredictability (for the predictability -- see Frost). In particular, the so-called grammatical rhymes are often too trivial. The other consideration, common to other poetic devices, is the distance between the two involved elements; in the case of rhymes it's simple, the larger the distance the better (granted that otherwise, the text makes sense) Here is the list of the sonnet's rhymes:
  • L1+L3: a dress ---- impress (a noun vs a verb);
  • L2+L4: London ---- abandon (huge distance; specific London and abstract noun abandon which to me sound almost like a verb or even an adjective;
  • L5+L7:stiches ---- bewitches (a plural noun vs a singular verb);
  • L6+L7:flattering ---- pampering (oh, well... , it's ok)
  • L9-L11:at my neck ---- no raincheck (reasonable distance, 1 negation adds to variety);
  • L10-L12:shoes too ---- renew (an adverb vs a verb);
  • L13-L14:park ---- dark (a noun vs an adjective)
It's far from common to have such rhymes' high quality.


Remark: At a very early Internet year there was an Indian poet on rec.arts.poems whose rhymes were nothing but "...ing". We liked his poetry, he was good. The art is about selecting certain directions and going there to an extreme, it's about perfectness within the chosen domain.

Remark: I've mentioned distance. In the case of rhymes, it's simple. The distance is even more important in the case of simile, metaphor, juxtaposition, and kenning. This time the situation in the mentioned four instances is more involved. The distance cannot be forced, one should never manhandle the poetry. The distance should be impressive but the text must be instantly convincing. The reader should feel AHA! rather than feeling impressed by the author's inventiveness and intelligence (then it's fake).

=======

I have to stop now. I may continue later (or not).

Clearly this assessment elaborates on your impressed postion (entirely subjective imo). How does that support your other stated impression of it being predictable?

(I wasn't aware that any of these challenge poems were free-for-all open critique as well? Typically, isn't that done as a courtesy upon request or invitation from the author?)
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Old 04-16-2019, 06:02 PM   #43
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entirely subjective imo
Mrtenant, you're out of your mind, you talk like that hypocritical faked PF&D aunt

The sonnet's language, it's vocabulary, etc. -- all this is OBJECTIVE. I thought that these FACTS are obvious but I can go into details. Anyway, just for the starters, you don't see any curse 4-letter words here, and this is objective too. Do I need to go on or do you see now that the quality of the language of this sonnet is an OBJECTIVE matter, not subjective?

The issue of rhymes is OBJECTIVE. The distinction between grammatical and non-grammatical rhymes is OBJECTIVE. The notion of the distance is not 100% precise but it is still totally OBJECTIVE. (Objective doesn't have to mean 100% precise).

ETC.!!!

Quote:
I wasn't aware that any of these challenge poems were free-for-all open critique as well? Typically, isn't that done as a courtesy upon request or invitation from the author?
I don't know what this your statement is doing in this thread and why do you feel its necessity but anyway, cascadiabound may redirect the eventual continuation of this discussion to a new thread. Let me know (no action will mean no action).

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 06:05 PM. Reason: Eng.
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Old 04-16-2019, 06:19 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Senna Jawa View Post
Mrtenant, you're out of your mind, you talk like that hypocritical faked PF&D aunt

The sonnet's language, it's vocabulary, etc. -- all this is OBJECTIVE. I thought that these FACTS are obvious but I can go into details. Anyway, just for the starters, you don't see any curse 4-letter words here, and this is objective too. Do I need to go on or do you see now that the quality of the language of this sonnet is an OBJECTIVE matter, not subjective?

The issue of rhymes is OBJECTIVE. The distinction between grammatical and non-grammatical rhymes is OBJECTIVE. The notion of the distance is not 100% precise but it is still totally OBJECTIVE. (Objective doesn't have to mean 100% precise).

ETC.!!!




I don't know what this your statement is doing in this thread and why do you feel its necessity but anyway, cascadiabound may redirect the eventual continuation of this discussion to a new thread. Let me know (no action will mean no action).


Out of mind eh? Been called worse. I wouldn't get all butthurt about it though.

The subjective is you as the person reading it and your subjective opinion. Not the piece itself. You do understand that, right? Someone has a different opinion. (I know, its wrong, yours is the only one that counts)

Whatever action are you going on about?
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Old 04-16-2019, 06:53 PM   #45
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The subjective is you as the person reading it and your subjective opinion.
This is some shambo-mambo rumbling. You're not supposed to talk about me at all, this PF&D is not a psycho-garbage-analyses group (or is it?!) -- stick to Poetry.

Quote:
Not the piece itself. You do understand that, right? Someone has a different opinion. (I know, its wrong, yours is the only one that counts)

Whatever action are you going on about?
I state FACTS. Others guys have OPINIONS (ugh!). I am not into opinions. I deal with the FACTS.

You say "You do understand that, right?" -- Oh, how a nice person you-Mrtenant are right now -- incredible! and you're such a super-expert on understanding, wow!

Perhaps, Mrtenants, you can quit making your own subjective opinions and give us a glimpse at your teensy-tinsy oh-so-superb super-understanding.

Last edited by Senna Jawa : 04-16-2019 at 06:58 PM.
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Old 04-16-2019, 07:08 PM   #46
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This is some shambo-mambo rumbling. You're not supposed to talk about me at all, this PF&D is not a psycho-garbage-analyses group (or is it?!) -- stick to Poetry.



I state FACTS. Others guys have OPINIONS (ugh!). I am not into opinions. I deal with the FACTS.

You say "You do understand that, right?" -- Oh, how a nice person you-Mrtenant are right now -- incredible! and you're such a super-expert on understanding, wow!

Perhaps, Mrtenants, you can quit making your own subjective opinions and give us a glimpse at your teensy-tinsy oh-so-superb super-understanding.
You are amazing. Thank you for sharing.

My opinion, ....simple, I love the poem. The more I read it, the more I love it. It's written by a real flesh and blood human being. Shows progression from previous efforts of several different styles of poetry and of course, effort. Looking forward to seeing more. I love poems with all their faults. Sometimes I can't say precisely what's off about anything, ultimately though, it's a work of her own creation. That I love. I see growth, design, effort, attention to detail, and craft. I wouldn't change a thing. I am humbled by her choice to share her sense of art with me, with us. Therein is beauty. These, are facts laced with opinion. I'll say no more.
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Old 04-16-2019, 07:42 PM   #47
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Btw

Quote:
Originally Posted by cascadiabound View Post
Dressmaker dressmaker make me a dress
cobalt blue silk and new lace from London
make it so pretty and sure to impress
bishop sleeves and skirts swirl with abandon

six yards double gauged with fine hand stitches
Tuck’d and pleated bodice so flattering
a dress so fine a mere glance bewitches
a blush, a look, a bit of pampering

ivory comb in my hair, broach at my neck
corset, petticoats and leather shoes too
give me your hand love, I’ll take no raincheck
dark eyes meet hazel our love will renew

darling, pray dance me ‘round the lovely park
twirl me, embrace me until it is dark
..
Thematically I think this poem is brilliant.
Welcome to the ranks of Sonneteers, lovely
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Old 04-16-2019, 08:32 PM   #48
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accents and feet

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHill View Post
..
Thematically I think this poem [by cascadiabound] is brilliant.
Thematically -- meaning a sonnet. I wish that you or another expert, in this or in a new thread, would cover the rhythmic aspect, all these sonnet accents and feet. One could illustrate such an essay on either classic sonnets or some from Literotica.
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Old 04-16-2019, 08:48 PM   #49
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Thematically meaning the subject thread that runs through it. Form or free verse matter not on that category.

Not interested in smelly iambic feet. pass

eta: Anyone who considers me an expert in any subject should get out more.
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"I'll never be a poet" - The Harry

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Old 08-16-2019, 11:12 AM   #50
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..
Add link
...
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