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Dershowitz: Trump 100% Right There Never Should Have Been Special Counsel

You don't know what you're talking about. Have we even seen any Congressional testimony? No, because the Rs are hiding it all away from the public in "closed" sessions. So what testimony are you even talking about?

Still we know a lot about what witnesses they've talked to, and plenty of this has been addressed. Even the House Rs admitted it in their recent report "exonerating" Trump of collusion.

In regards to Mueller, his investigation is ongoing, how many times can we say it? Maybe he'll come to the same conclusion as the partisan hacks in the House, but I doubt it.

DawnODay said:
Then why is there not even a whiff of this in any indictment or any congressional testimony?
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DawnODay said:
Then why is there not even a whiff of this in any indictment or any congressional testimony?
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Just because you refuse to whiff the stench of corruption dangling in front of your nose doesn't mean that everyone else is refusing to do the same.

And, oh, look, I managed to type that with the bold key off.
 
KeithD said:
And, oh, look, I managed to type that with the bold key off.
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No bold? That's a sign of weakness on the GB! Only wimps type normally, with good orthography and tolerance for faults.
 
"You can find evidence to create or manufacture crimes against anybody, if you're determined to do it. That's what's wrong with the special counsel. Because they come in with targets painted on people's back.... Whether they have to go and try to find a technical violation of banking laws on which they can hook pornography stars or things of that kind.... That's why we have to restrict and limit the application of the criminal law to clear, unequivocal crimes and don't use it against political enemies unless the evidence is overwhelming."​

I. Schwartz, Dershowitz: You Can Manufacture Crimes Against Anybody, That's What's Wrong With The Special Counsel, RealClearPolitics (Apr. 11, 2018).
 
There's loads of bullshit in this quote.

1. Dershowitz is speaking as if he knows what the Mueller probe has or doesn't have. He speaks as if HE knows that "the evidence in not overwhelming," when he does not. He knows nothing. He talks as if the Mueller team had nothing but a political motive to prosecute someone, and then went looking for so-called "evidence." He doesn't know that. He does not know what the "probable cause" was to begin it. He's merely ascribing and reeling off fantasy.

2. The Stormy Daniels case has nothing to do with the Special Counsel probe. He's conflating them. The opposite is true. Mueller came across evidence related to Cohen and passed it on to NY State. They're unrelated.

3. He states that the bank laws violations are a mere pretext to "hook pornography stars," whatever that means, as if violation of bank laws is not in and of itself a crime, and as if the raid on Cohen was ultimately about bringing down Stormy Daniels, which makes no sense. Bank fraud is a "clear, unequivocal crime". That's the crime Cohen, not Stormy, is "on the hook" for. He's misstating the FACTS to make a POLITICAL point, which makes him the criminal.


DawnODay said:
"You can find evidence to create or manufacture crimes against anybody, if you're determined to do it. That's what's wrong with the special counsel. Because they come in with targets painted on people's back.... Whether they have to go and try to find a technical violation of banking laws on which they can hook pornography stars or things of that kind.... That's why we have to restrict and limit the application of the criminal law to clear, unequivocal crimes and don't use it against political enemies unless the evidence is overwhelming."​

I. Schwartz, Dershowitz: You Can Manufacture Crimes Against Anybody, That's What's Wrong With The Special Counsel, RealClearPolitics (Apr. 11, 2018).
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Dershowitz has been opining on matters of which he has no personal knowledge or experience for forty years. Why would he stop now?
 
I wanted Jim Webb to be Presidennt. None of the GOP made me happy, including Trump. But Hillary was least appealing. Trump won and here we are with an insurrection launched by the elites, media, and celebrities. The Bush and Clinton people are on the same team. Mueller is their hired gun.
 
Carnal_Flower said:
2. The Stormy Daniels case has nothing to do with the Special Counsel probe. He's conflating them. The opposite is true. Mueller came across evidence related to Cohen and passed it on to NY State. They're unrelated.
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No, he passed it to the federal prosecutor (US Attorney) office in Manhattan, SDNY (Southern District of New York), not to the state. It's still a federal probe. Firing Mueller won't make it go away. Tromp will need to fire his own personal choice for US Attorney. Again.

FEELINGLUCKYPUNK said:
I wanted Jim Webb to be Presidennt. None of the GOP made me happy, including Trump. But Hillary was least appealing. Trump won and here we are with an insurrection launched by the elites, media, and celebrities. The Bush and Clinton people are on the same team. Mueller is their hired gun.
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Your BS trolls aren't really funny. Tromp IS a criminal and IS a media elite celeb. Go see his star on Hollywood Blvd. And he won the game but lost the nation. That's going well.

Adre said:
Dershowitz has been opining on matters of which he has no personal knowledge or experience for forty years. Why would he stop now?
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Laryngitis? Paralysis? Dengue fever?
 
Yes, SDNY you're right


Hypoxia said:
No, he passed it to the federal prosecutor (US Attorney) office in Manhattan, SDNY (Southern District of New York), not to the state. It's still a federal probe. Firing Mueller won't make it go away. Tromp will need to fire his own personal choice for US Attorney. Again.


Your BS trolls aren't really funny. Tromp IS a criminal and IS a media elite celeb. Go see his star on Hollywood Blvd. And he won the game but lost the nation. That's going well.

Laryngitis? Paralysis? Dengue fever?
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I never paid attention to the guy. What a complete buffoon and liar. Or idiot.

Adre said:
Dershowitz has been opining on matters of which he has no personal knowledge or experience for forty years. Why would he stop now?
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Trump prevailed over all and we pretend he's the dummy. No one can defeat him so far yet most talk nonsense. Dershowitz is Trumps next Attorney General or SCOTUS nominee.
 
Trump is pissed to high heaven that LEO's are doing their jobs, and throwing sabots into the wheels of justice. But why, Mister President?
 
Special counsel Robert Mueller’s office is warning that “many” news articles on the Trump-Russia probe have been wrong.

The statement from a spokesperson did not single out particular stories. But the warning did come after media inquiries about a McClatchy News story on Friday that said Mr. Mueller has evidence that President Trump’s personal attorney, Michael Cohen, did in fact travel to Prague in 2016 as alleged by the Christopher Steele dossier....

There has been no official or press confirmation of Mr. Steele’s Prague allegation nor of a number of other Steele collusion charges. His work was financed by the Democratic National Committee and the Hillary Clinton campaign.

For his part, Mr. Cohen has repeatedly denied under oath, and thus under the penalty of perjury, that he traveled to Prague. If he did in fact go there, he would be unlikely to lie under oath to Congress since the FBI’s investigative powers would be able to track his movements....

The supposed Cohen Prague trip has been pushed to reporters and government investigators by Glenn Simpson, co-founder of Fusion GPS, which paid Mr. Steele. Fusion has long-standing relationships with Washington’s powerful news outlets such as CNN, the Washington Post and the New York Times.

Mr. Simpson still believes Mr. Cohen went to Prague. He told the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence that Mr. Cohen may have traveled by yacht and a Russian’s plane.

Mr. Cohen has sued Fusion for libel.​

R. Scarborough, Robert Mueller’s warning: ‘Many’ news stories on Trump-Russia probe are wrong, Washington Times (Apr. 16, 2018).
 
DawnODay said:
Special counsel Robert Mueller’s office is warning that “many” news articles on the Trump-Russia probe have been wrong.

The statement from a spokesperson did not single out particular stories. But the warning did come after media inquiries about a McClatchy News story on Friday that said Mr. Mueller has evidence that President Trump’s personal attorney, Michael Cohen, did in fact travel to Prague in 2016 as alleged by the Christopher Steele dossier....

There has been no official or press confirmation of Mr. Steele’s Prague allegation nor of a number of other Steele collusion charges. His work was financed by the Democratic National Committee and the Hillary Clinton campaign.

For his part, Mr. Cohen has repeatedly denied under oath, and thus under the penalty of perjury, that he traveled to Prague. If he did in fact go there, he would be unlikely to lie under oath to Congress since the FBI’s investigative powers would be able to track his movements....

The supposed Cohen Prague trip has been pushed to reporters and government investigators by Glenn Simpson, co-founder of Fusion GPS, which paid Mr. Steele. Fusion has long-standing relationships with Washington’s powerful news outlets such as CNN, the Washington Post and the New York Times.

Mr. Simpson still believes Mr. Cohen went to Prague. He told the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence that Mr. Cohen may have traveled by yacht and a Russian’s plane.

Mr. Cohen has sued Fusion for libel.​

R. Scarborough, Robert Mueller’s warning: ‘Many’ news stories on Trump-Russia probe are wrong, Washington Times (Apr. 16, 2018).
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Mr. Cohen has withdrawn his suit. He has also been proven to have traveled to Prague. Also, evidence has come to light that Trump stayed in Russia when the Steele dossier said he did, even though Trump had denied this.
 
wrant said:
Mr. Cohen has withdrawn his suit. He has also been proven to have traveled to Prague. Also, evidence has come to light that Trump stayed in Russia when the Steele dossier said he did, even though Trump had denied this.
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Thank you for this and, please, keep bringing up the Steele dossier. It is, after all, proof of the Clinton campaign's collusion with Russians to try to influence the 2016 election. M. Barone, The Real Case of Collusion: As Mueller’s investigation winds down, evidence is building that the Obama administration colluded to help elect Hillary Clinton, National Review (Apr. 20, 2018); E. Pandy, Clinton campaign, DNC backed research for Trump-Russia dossier, Axios (Oct. 24, 2017); P.R. Gregory, The Trump Dossier Is Fake -- And Here Are The Reasons Why, Forbes (Jan. 13, 2017) (note the date of this last article, and how long the media ignored the problems with the dossier because they so badly wanted to use it against the administration).
 
DawnODay said:
Thank you for this and, please, keep bringing up the Steele dossier. It is, after all, proof of the Clinton campaign's collusion with Russians to try to influence the 2016 election.
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Steele's probe was started by anti-Tromp Gups. Tromp publicly invited Russia to hack Hillary. Tromp is owned by Moscow mafiyas. Connect dots.

phrodeau said:
Trump is pissed to high heaven that LEO's are doing their jobs, and throwing sabots into the wheels of justice. But why, Mister President?
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He doesn't know how not to act guilty. That kind of invites probes. Bother.
 
Hypoxia said:
Steele's probe was started by anti-Tromp Gups....
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Get your facts straight. That was a false rumor planted by Glenn Simpson back in early 2017 to deflect attention from the fact that the fake dossier was done for the Clinton campaign. The DNC has since admitted this. Why would the DNC admit that if it was anything else?
 
DawnODay said:
Get your facts straight. That was a false rumor planted by Glenn Simpson back in early 2017 to deflect attention from the fact that the fake dossier was done for the Clinton campaign. The DNC has since admitted this. Why would the DNC admit that if it was anything else?
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Wikipedia entry:
A private investigative firm, Fusion GPS, provided political opposition research against Trump in two distinct phases, with completely separate funders. Fusion GPS was first contracted by a conservative political website, The Washington Free Beacon, and Steele was not involved in that research. When Trump became the presumptive nominee on May 3, 2016, The Free Beacon stopped their backing. Separately, in April 2016, attorney Marc Elias hired Fusion GPS to investigate Trump on behalf of Hillary Clinton's campaign and the Democratic National Committee (DNC). In June 2016, Fusion GPS subcontracted Steele to research and compile the dossier; senior Clinton campaign officials were reportedly unaware that Fusion GPS had subcontracted with Steele, and Steele was not told the Clinton campaign was the ultimate recipient of his research.[7][8]

Following Trump's election as president, funding from Clinton and the DNC ceased, but Steele continued his research, and was reportedly paid directly by Glenn R. Simpson, a co-founder of Fusion GPS.[9]The completed dossier was then handed to British and American intelligence services.[10] Weeks before the 2016 election, on the basis of Steele's reputation working on Russia-related matters for nearly 20 years, the FBI reached an agreement to pay Steele to continue his work; the agreement was later terminated as information about the dossier became public.[11]

Some of the dossier's allegations have been corroborated, while others remain unverified[12] and may require access to classified information for verification.[13] The media, the intelligence community, and most experts have treated the dossier with caution, while Trump himself denounced the report as "fake news". In February 2017, some details related to conversations "solely between foreign nationals" were independently verified. Some of those individuals were known to be "heavily involved" in efforts to damage Clinton and help Trump. The conversations "took place between the same individuals on the same days and from the same locations as detailed in the dossier", giving US intelligence and law enforcement "greater confidence" in the credibility of parts of the document.[14]
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Alas, the "fake dossier" originated on the Gup side and much has been verified. Your conspiracy theory doesn't hold together. Regrets.
 
ThatsTheGuy said:
That poster supplied a viable and trusted link.
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Really? Because I thought he used Wikipedia.

ThatsTheGuy said:
Can you say the same?
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Of course I can:

"Steele was paid $160,000 to create the Trump dossier for Fusion GPS. The Hillary Clinton presidential campaign and Democratic National Committee financed the work." Memo: FBI Used Tainted Steele Dossier, Paid For By Hillary Clinton, As Reason To Spy On Trump, Investor's Business Daily (Feb. 2, 2018).

As I wrote above, the idea that a Republican initiated the fake dossier was a false rumor planted by Glenn Simpson to deflect attention from the fact that the fake dossier was created for the Clinton campaign. This rumor continued to show up in articles in 2017, even after it was established that Clinton had funded the fake dossier. E.g., A. Entous, D. Barrett & R.S. Helderman, Clinton campaign, DNC paid for research that led to Russia dossier, Washington Post (Oct. 24. 2017). It is now well established that the fake dossier was a DNC creation from the start.
 
DawnODay said:
Really? Because I thought he used Wikipedia.



Of course I can:

"Steele was paid $160,000 to create the Trump dossier for Fusion GPS. The Hillary Clinton presidential campaign and Democratic National Committee financed the work." Memo: FBI Used Tainted Steele Dossier, Paid For By Hillary Clinton, As Reason To Spy On Trump, Investor's Business Daily (Feb. 2, 2018).

As I wrote above, the idea that a Republican initiated the fake dossier was a false rumor planted by Glenn Simpson to deflect attention from the fact that the fake dossier was created for the Clinton campaign. This rumor continued to show up in articles in 2017, even after it was established that Clinton had funded the fake dossier. E.g., A. Entous, D. Barrett & R.S. Helderman, Clinton campaign, DNC paid for research that led to Russia dossier, Washington Post (Oct. 24. 2017). It is now well established that the fake dossier was a DNC creation from the start.
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Ya lost me at "Paid for by Hillary", then DNC.

Perhaps I misunderstood?

Also, still not changing my mind about Wikki as a reliable source. I won't go into that either.
 
Last edited:
DawnODay said:
Oh! Well if Wikipedia says it, it must be true.

:rolleyes:
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I remember you claiming Forbes as the only trust-worthy news site and then when I showed you stuff on there that destroyed your point you kind of stopped posting for two weeks...care to explain?
 
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