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Old 11-11-2013, 09:09 PM   #26
lovecraft68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyVer View Post
Would you like to clarify your point? I have no idea what you're saying here.
She's being sarcastic.

But I can answer and that's don't bother. Laurel will sometimes post she is looking for suggestions on all kinds of things, contests, the way stories are searched etc... She has brought up a Bi-sexual category and many people responded positively

Then.....nothing.

Lately even the contests have been forgotten about. She's not going to put a huge effort into overhauling the VE. The e-mail us feature hasn't worked in years meaning unless you know to come to the boards and pm her, no one can contact the site with an issue. She has not fixed that, she sure as hell won't do this.

But if you want to try post something in the isolated blurt thread in the GB. She might see it there.
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Old 11-11-2013, 09:15 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovecraft68 View Post
She's being sarcastic.

But I can answer and that's don't bother. Laurel will sometimes post she is looking for suggestions on all kinds of things, contests, the way stories are searched etc... She has brought up a Bi-sexual category and many people responded positively

Then.....nothing.

Lately even the contests have been forgotten about. She's not going to put a huge effort into overhauling the VE. The e-mail us feature hasn't worked in years meaning unless you know to come to the boards and pm her, no one can contact the site with an issue. She has not fixed that, she sure as hell won't do this.

But if you want to try post something in the isolated blurt thread in the GB. She might see it there.
Thanks for clarifying.
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Old 11-11-2013, 09:23 PM   #28
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I pretty much agree with Lovecraft68 on this. I think Laurel and Manu would address an infrequent specific issue (like the one running on another thread), but not a large number of them. And I don't think that she will kill the nonfunctioning (and, I think, misleading and dangerous to the writers) VE program, which she could do with a single statement on the forum and some page erasing, because, even though the program is just pretend, it gives the Web site false cachet.

The functional connection between writer and editor is the "available this month" permanent thread at the top of this forum.
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Old 11-11-2013, 09:58 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
I pretty much agree with Lovecraft68 on this. I think Laurel and Manu would address an infrequent specific issue (like the one running on another thread), but not a large number of them. And I don't think that she will kill the nonfunctioning (and, I think, misleading and dangerous to the writers) VE program, which she could do with a single statement on the forum and some page erasing, because, even though the program is just pretend, it gives the Web site false cachet.

The functional connection between writer and editor is the "available this month" permanent thread at the top of this forum.
I'm still trying to understand your issue with the VE program. Are you saying that the program should be gotten rid of, that there should be no editor profiles?

I still don't get where the program is misleading, especially with what's written about the program on the sticky notes and the FAQs, and when the program is named Volunteer Editors, not Professional Editors.

I've found two big editing projects through the editor request threads on the EF. I've gotten several projects from just commenting on the EH. Most of my projects, though, have come directly through the VE list. If I get contacted to edit outside the VE list, I send a link to my editor's profile which shows the categories I edit for and the way I work, which is extremely helpful to me and the writer.
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:03 PM   #30
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If you haven't seen the problems folks are having in finding help through the VE system, you are either dense (my vote. This isn't exactly the first time we've been through this), haven't been paying attention, or are being extremely defensive. Actually, my vote is for all three.
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:21 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
If you haven't seen the problems folks are having in finding help through the VE system, you are either dense (my vote. This isn't exactly the first time we've been through this), haven't been paying attention, or are being extremely defensive. Actually, my vote is for all three.
I see you're being an ass as usual. Don't let me stop you.

Put your money where your mouth is and create a thread to out editors. That, or stop whining. It gets old.

Lit writers will continue to have problems finding good, dependable volunteer editors on Lit because 1) the VOLUNTEER program is VOLUNTEER, 2) good editors don't grow on trees, 3) many writers don't know how to work with or talk to their editor, and 4) good editors are busy, Sherlock.
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:33 PM   #32
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Hmm. Take direction from "Lady" V? Not today (or tomorrow--or ever). That would be about as hairbrained as my feeling obligated to PM you about anything.

Sorry, you're a total loss to try to discuss anything with. Posting to you is like talking to a fence post.

By the way, I didn't post anything different from what Lovecraft68 did. How interesting that you only went after me. When Lovecraft said it, you said he had clarified your so-called thinking.

How many times has ML pointed out to you the humongous list of VEs and how few of them actually respond to anything? This very thread shows an example of someone sent on a three-month goose chase by this system. Did you not even know what the thread was about that you were posting to?
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:54 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Hmm. Take direction from "Lady" V? Not today (or tomorrow--or ever). That would be about as hairbrained as my feeling obligated to PM you about anything.

Sorry, you're a total loss to try to discuss anything with. Posting to you is like talking to a fence post.

By the way, I didn't post anything different from what Lovecraft68 did. How interesting that you only went after me. When Lovecraft said it, you said he had clarified you so-called thinking.

How many times has ML pointed out to you the humongous list of VEs and how few of them actually respond to anything? This very thread shows an example of someone sent on a three-month goose chase by this system.
You know, Pilot, you're an ass. You don't have to like me or what I say. But you go out of your way to be offensive, and I have a hard time understanding that. You claim to care about writers. To me, it's just an empty claim because you're just as offensive to writers as you are to editors.

Now, run along and play with the other trolls since you're only interested in having a conversation where you act like the cock of the walk, when in reality you're the jerk of the AH and the EF.
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:06 PM   #34
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No, I didn't think you had anything substantive to say about not being able to "get it" time and time again.
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:09 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
No, I didn't think you had anything substantive to say about not being able to "get it" time and time again.
Interesting. Yet, you're still talking to me. Are you that hard up to prove your Lit knowledge?
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:12 PM   #36
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Maybe for the reason that you keep posting to me? (Although, if anyone wants to check, they can see that I always stop a long time before you do.)

You're still avoiding responding to anything I pointed out in my penultimate posting. How many times has the humongous VE list and the failure of those on the list to respond been pointed out to you? Why did you only go after me when I just supported what Lovecraft68 posted (that you considered clarifying)? Why haven't you noticed that you're posting "everything is working" to a thread complaining that it isn't?
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:19 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Maybe for the reason that you keep posting to me? (Although, if anyone wants to check, they can see that I always stop a long time before you do.)
You know, we should have a thread on the EH. It would be like a Who's on First for editors. You would play the bad editor and I would play the good editor. Then we wouldn't be taking up space in other people's threads.

BTW, the truth-o-meter went way past the red on your second statement. We all know who has to have the last word on the EF and AH.
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Old 11-11-2013, 11:49 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post

You're still avoiding responding to anything I pointed out in my penultimate posting. How many times has the humongous VE list and the failure of those on the list to respond been pointed out to you? Why did you only go after me when I just supported what Lovecraft68 posted (that you considered clarifying)? Why haven't you noticed that you're posting "everything is working" to a thread complaining that it isn't?
I wasn't avoiding it. I just didn't think it was important.

Again, the VE program is on a free porn site and consists of VOLUNTEER editors who edit for a lot of inexperienced writers. Maybe if the site became a paid site, then both writers and editors would both be more dependable.

I saw LC's post as just clarifying what ML was trying to say. Besides, I know what he thinks about the VE program and your idea of outing editors.

I'm not posting everything is working. I'm posting that the editor program is not as broken as you claim it is. You and ML both have insisted that the VE list is totally broken, when it isn't. You're just so blind to what's good about the program, all you see is the bad. BTW, do you have an editor profile?
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Old 11-12-2013, 01:54 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by LadyVer View Post
I wasn't avoiding it. I just didn't think it was important.

Again, the VE program is on a free porn site and consists of VOLUNTEER editors who edit for a lot of inexperienced writers. Maybe if the site became a paid site, then both writers and editors would both be more dependable.

I saw LC's post as just clarifying what ML was trying to say. You need new glasses then.
Besides, I know what he thinks about the VE program and your idea of outing editors.

I'm not posting everything is working. I'm posting that the editor program is not as broken as you claim it is. You and ML both have insisted that the VE list is totally broken, when it isn't. Of course I wouldn't know anything about what works here. I've been here all of what, seven years, compared to your what, year and a half?
You're just so blind to what's good about the program, all you see is the bad. BTW, do you have an editor profile?

Don't forget this free porn site consists of a large number of professional writers too.
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Old 11-12-2013, 04:14 AM   #40
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Don't forget this free porn site consists of a large number of professional writers too.
Yes, I don't see many of them commenting though. They may be too busy.

Apparently, LC was wrong about what your point was, so I have no clue what you were trying to say.

The issue with the VE program isn't about how long one's been a member, ML. We've been through this before. I can understand the frustration writers have with finding a good editor. I've worked with Lit writers who weren't happy with previous editors.

I feel frustration at times myself as a volunteer editor with some of the stories I get asked to edit. Either the story wasn't written by a native English speaker, or the writer thinks an editor does major revising that the writer should himself should do, or the writer doesn't understand what an editor does. I've gotten poorly written stories of up to 100 pages with mechanical errors that defy logic, full of sentences that make absolutely no sense. Or the writer can't remember what his story is about because he wrote it months back when he was sick. Or the 70-page story that is one entire sex scene written by a non-native English speaker.

I have other writers I edit for who are easy to edit for. Their stories have minor mechanical issues, but it's usually not much of a problem.

So, I have a hard time thinking the only problem with Lit stories lies solely with editors.

I'm thinking of creating a thread to talk to you and Pilot so we don't continue to bore everyone else.
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Old 11-12-2013, 08:21 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by LadyVer View Post
I'm still trying to understand your issue with the VE program. Are you saying that the program should be gotten rid of, that there should be no editor profiles?

I still don't get where the program is misleading, especially with what's written about the program on the sticky notes and the FAQs, and when the program is named Volunteer Editors, not Professional Editors.
The problem with the VE list is that is unwieldly and unchanged. There are profiles from editors who are no longer on the site, and so many writers waste time sending requests and then waiting for a response that won't come. The list is never culled for defunct profiles.

Now, I myself am on the VE list and have gotten requests from it and dealt with them quickly. I can't always say yes, but I do give a timely response.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with the VE list, but the "available editors" sticky is much more useful, and current.
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Old 11-12-2013, 09:22 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by PennLady View Post
The problem with the VE list is that is unwieldly and unchanged. There are profiles from editors who are no longer on the site, and so many writers waste time sending requests and then waiting for a response that won't come. The list is never culled for defunct profiles.

Now, I myself am on the VE list and have gotten requests from it and dealt with them quickly. I can't always say yes, but I do give a timely response.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with the VE list, but the "available editors" sticky is much more useful, and current.



For my part, I'd just drop the whole VE thing and elevate SR71 to Lord Editor In Charge and also make him Lord Editor of Literotica with full control of who posts, who is published and who may edit.
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Old 11-12-2013, 12:42 PM   #43
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For my part, I'd just drop the whole VE thing and elevate SR71 to Lord Editor In Charge and also make him Lord Editor of Literotica with full control of who posts, who is published and who may edit.
So, you'd shoot the messenger just because they had the balls to point out that the system should be revamped or dropped.

What are your suggestions for a workable system, or do you just sit there and engage in pot shots? I've made suggestions, none of which involve me being Lord Editor or controlling anything, so you're just being nasty and bitchy there.
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Old 11-12-2013, 03:00 PM   #44
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So, you'd shoot the messenger just because they had the balls to point out that the system should be revamped or dropped.

What are your suggestions for a workable system, or do you just sit there and engage in pot shots? I've made suggestions, none of which involve me being Lord Editor or controlling anything, so you're just being nasty and bitchy there.
Why do you assume I care if the system works?

Why do you think it should be revamped or dropped? If even one author finds an editor and succeeds, is it not then worthy of keeping? Does it have to be 100% or nothing?

The simplest system would be to give authors a feedback system for the editor profiles. Even anonymous feedback could help an author with selection, although trolls might just have a field day.

A quarterly check-in for editor profiles would delete 95% (or more) of the inactive profiles after the first 3 months and only at least marginally active editors would be listed. They managed to get a fifteen minutes idle log off for the forums, certainly adding a 3 month check-box for volunteer editors is possible.

The VE program is a minor bit on the site and it works well enough for those who take the time to research their choices and follow up with frequent email and private messages. I don't think any changes are likely to come, but you can rail at Laurel all you wish.


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Old 11-12-2013, 06:40 PM   #45
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The problem with the VE list is that is unwieldly and unchanged. There are profiles from editors who are no longer on the site, and so many writers waste time sending requests and then waiting for a response that won't come. The list is never culled for defunct profiles.

Now, I myself am on the VE list and have gotten requests from it and dealt with them quickly. I can't always say yes, but I do give a timely response.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with the VE list, but the "available editors" sticky is much more useful, and current.
I can see where editors who haven't updated their profile in a long time could be dropped. kbate's idea about a quarterly check-in sounds like a good idea. The first few pages of the VE list show the most currently active editors, as it's sorted chronologically. It makes sense that writers have the option of viewing the list.

I question whether the available editor thread is that much useful or better, although it's always good to have the option. I do like viewing editing request threads in the EF. I've found several very good writers this way.

I think it would be impossible for every editor to accept every editing project. There are too many variables. My VE profile states I reply to emails within 24 hours, which I do.
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Old 11-12-2013, 08:29 PM   #46
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Red face

Wow my original thread sure sparked a debate!

Since I'm new here I really don't know what would be the best solution.
All I can tell you is from personal experience, it had nothing to do with if the VE
had an old profile or not.
Sure I contacted a few and if they didn't get back to me but I went on to the next.

With this particular editor that I dealt with, they replied to me right away and was very interested in my story and felt they were able to help me.

We exchanged a few emails, I sent the story, we spoke about what I wanted help with, they replied asking if its okay if they tweaked other things and overall it was good interaction.

After a few months of no updates, that's when I emailed them and asked if everything was okay.
And nothing. This was my first time talking to a VE so I had no idea how long a story of this length would take to edit.

Like I said, had the person just not acknowledged me from the beginning than yes I would have moved on. But I felt that we had a good back and forth that I would eventually get my story edited.

So even if a person has a current profile it doesn't mean that they can just abandon your story when they feel like it, even if you've spoken.

Thats just my personal experience on here.

SINCE Im moving on now, I would love it if a new VE came forth and helped me with my story.

Its just an interracial, hetero, vacation, sexy romp Ive always wanted to submit but I feel like I need help with punctuation and dialogue. If anyone is willing to help, Id greatly appreciate it.

Again sorry for sparking such a debate.
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Old 11-12-2013, 09:47 PM   #47
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Just a note. An editor should give an author a turnaround time, a date the author can expect delivery. Experienced editors know how long a story will take to edit and how to fit a new project into their schedule, and will be able to deliver it by the deadline, or close to it.

The author shouldn't be left hanging, wondering when the editor will get the edited story to them.

Editors need to keep their author informed during the editing project of the project status: how far along the project is, if they're having problems with the story, what they think of the story (if it's good, or something sounds off, etc).

The writer needs to respond to the editor's updates within a reasonable time frame so the editor isn't left wondering if the writer has backed out, had an emergency, or died, etc. If the writer is writing a series and writing the chapters as he goes along, he needs to let the editor know when to expect the other chapters so he/she can fit the chapter into their schedule.

One problem that new editors have, and I experienced this when I first started editing, is over-commitment. We want to be able to edit good stories, but actually being able to do it when other authors are sending us editing requests, and a paid project or new job comes up, leads to disappointing some authors. The best thing an editor can do is keep the writer in the loop on these issues within a reasonable time frame (48 hours) and learn when to say "no" to a project.

If the author doesn't hear from the editor after one-two weeks, and especially after the editor has missed the deadline, the author needs to contact the editor and ask how the project is going and if the editor is having any problems. If the editor doesn't respond within 48 hours, this is a strong indication the editor, for whatever reason, has decided not to complete the project. Maybe the editor died. Who knows on Lit and the internet?

It's also extremely important that an editor like the genre/category they're editing and the story itself, because if they don't, it will cause problems, which could lead to an editor going MIA.

Hope I didn't overdo the advice.

Good luck, again!
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Old 11-13-2013, 12:42 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by NessAsity View Post
I would love it if a new VE came forth and helped me with my story.

If you still need an editor I can help you out. I have a turn around time of 24 hours or less (depending on how extensive the editing is), not three months.
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Old 11-13-2013, 12:30 PM   #49
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I appreciate the advice! I will know now for next time!

CambriaRose I sent you a PM. Thank you so much!
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Old 11-16-2013, 03:28 AM   #50
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BTW, the truth-o-meter went way past the red on your second statement. We all know who has to have the last word on the EF and AH.
This discussion got real funny when SR stopped and you didn't - showing us on the truth-o-meter who has to have the last word. So we all know now who has to have the last word?

A couple of fun discussions here where you didn't seem to understand much of anything.
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