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Old 11-18-2012, 05:33 AM   #26
sun_sea_sky
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Originally Posted by Euphony View Post
What Ive noticed though, often once they "get it on", no other conflict takes its place. Sure its drawn out via the possible sex acts they could move on to but that seems a "mini conflict" to me
The story that I wrote, that I like the most (not everyone agrees, it is currently 4.29) had the main characters not having sex at all, and indeed only one actual fuck in the entire story. The whole thing was the build-up, you thought "will they, won't they?".

I can think of quite a few TV shows, movies, etc. where the whole thing is sexual tension, and the movie ends just before they "do it", although you know now, they probably will.

Is that erotic? Not sure. Romantic, maybe.

Some of the stories here, by other authors, that I like the most are where the sex is late in the story, and then fairly brief, as if the tension is still there. Whereas the stories like "I noticed my sister had big tits so I fucked her senseless for the next year" don't make a heap of sense to me.
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Old 11-18-2012, 06:06 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphony View Post
Sex (will they or won't they) as the conflict: Common obviously. Depending on the cat. it can certainly be a long and winding road. What Ive noticed though, often once they "get it on", no other conflict takes its place. Sure its drawn out via the possible sex acts they could move on to but that seems a "mini conflict" to me ( do you agree/disagree?)

Ive also seen it in more than a few longer works where once they get to the fucking, the whole story then orbits the sex. I totally understand wanting to enjoy the destination after so much travel but man these people become nothing but (and often times butt) sex. I know we all do it like rabbits when we're in luuuuvvve but it just seems it could be better represented in the fiction.
Yeah, I know what you mean. As a long-time reader I used to shun multi-part series because so often the tension's all used up halfway through the first chapter and from there it's a long iteration of sexual combinatorics. Which is fine if you're into that, it just doesn't happen to be my thing. For me the sexy part is the courtship/seduction/flirtation/whatever you want to call it.

Then I started writing here, and my attempted one-shot turned into a multi-part series that's probably going to run to a dozen chapters by the time it's finished. Hoist on my own petard!

I was able to draw out the "will they/won't they" conflict for a few more chapters, because at first it's not clear whether it's a one-off encounter or something that's going to turn into a relationship. But you can only do that so long before readers start rolling their eyes, and in the later chapters the tension has to come from elsewhere - what's going to happen if Yvonne's homophobic boss finds out she's sleeping with his daughter, that sort of thing.
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Old 11-18-2012, 08:19 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
I think a lot of the "the story is more important to me than the sex" authors here are just frustrated mainstream wanna be writers who can't find a more appropriate venue for their output.
No, its simply a matter of taste. Some come here looking to write/read pure stroke and they find plenty of writers who deliver and the writers fond plenty of audience.

But there is also a faction of writers who strive for more than just stroke and like to tell a story along with the sex. Create characters people can care about for more than there cock or breast size. And like with the stroke crowd there are plenty of those writers and readers to make everyone happy.

Saying the people who enjoy telling a story are frustrated wannabe's is jusy another one of your snippy insulting comments and we'll see if anyone disagrees with me saying that.

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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Eh, what? I'm just trying to punch some holes in snobbery.
No, Pilot your above "wannabe" comment is snobbery. As usual.

As for your "warning" of beginners not to sweat it about stroke vs story? There is no need to. Each thread has a particular question someone is asking. In this case the OP is speaking from what they would like to write and strive for as a challenge. Its their thread their question.

I also note in my first response that I speak for my taste only. I am not a stroke writer or reader, but mention again that, that is my taste. I don't condemn people who come here for pure porno sex stories.

THis thread is not insulting anyone or saying one type of story is better than another, its the OP's opinion and looking for other opinions.

As always you have rendered yours as arrogantly as ever.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:27 AM   #29
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I like the idea of entering the story in sex and ending with it as well. Reading what you wrote. it's something to think about.
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Old 11-18-2012, 05:44 PM   #30
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It seems its consistency that is usually lacking. Stroke v. Erotica or whatever names you like for the type of work you are reading, whatever you start with should likely be what you end with unless its an unusual case.
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Old 11-19-2012, 09:05 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Doesn't have to be raw sex. Erotica is about arousal and accompanying emotions. These would be fine. But you go a whole chapter without something connected to erotic sensations, you ain't writing erotica anymore. You probablly should be chopping away at it to get it back into category control.
Sr - There's a whole world of difference between a full-on sex scene every chapter (which i inferred from your original couple of posts in this thread) and 'something connected to erotic sensations' - to my mind anyway.

So - the way sunlight and aspect plays with a skimpy garment, providing and hiding glimpses of hidden treasures - constitutes a sex scene for a chapter if you're writing commercially?
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Old 11-19-2012, 01:01 PM   #32
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Sr - There's a whole world of difference between a full-on sex scene every chapter (which i inferred from your original couple of posts in this thread) and 'something connected to erotic sensations' - to my mind anyway.
Yeah, mine too. I toned that down in my posts on that point and could tone it down either further, as noted below.

So - the way sunlight and aspect plays with a skimpy garment, providing and hiding glimpses of hidden treasures - constitutes a sex scene for a chapter if you're writing commercially?[/quote]

[quote=Exquisition;42554688]Yes that would sustain the erotica mood. It's pretty much the difference between writing porn and erotica, I think. I see the writing of successful erotica as the creation and sustaining of the sense of sensuality. I still see, however, that if you don't sustain that sense of sensuality across a chapter that doesn't have actual sex act(s) in it, you have lost the label of erotica and either have a mainstream piece or the need to chop away the stuff that's bursting the sensuality bubble.
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Old 11-20-2012, 12:56 AM   #33
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Oh, this is just a great subject. One of the best ever on AH, I think.

At a certain point in life I suppose - maybe at a VERY early point for some - sex becomes multiple-layered, rich, complex, and intellectually interesting as well as physically arousing or stimulating.

Someone at that point in their life or let's even say, mindset, is not going to be satisfied with just the mechanical details.

At the same time, it is an amazing challenge for a writer to try and maintain - as the pilot talked about - the arousal, AFTER the event in the story. I know he said build-up and maintain, but the OP also talked about what becomes of the story after the actual sex bit....

One thing I do know that for me, going on what I have observed from the responses and numbers for the stories I have put out there - whether here or when I actually did the old-school published stuff (which I won't do again, there's no point 4 me, unless they are REALLY expensive productions) - you leave out the hard-core stuff and the reader numbers go down. But then though, you can kinda also tell that the mass audience is not necessarily going to comprehend anything too clever anyway... So there's a trade-off you have to think about.

In the end, personally I will always want to go 'up' and play to the highest possible mentality that I possibly think I can speak to - and sometimes I get people who respond in ways that tell me, hey, my god, there are people out there who could give me a run for my money in the bedroom and in the lecture theatre! ...Snob? No possible way anyone can out snob me. I am the worst of the worst and I can't help it and I don't want to either!!!

For me, the higher you go - intellectually at least - the more interesting their gutter is anyway.

My ambition is to be able to write the absolute dirtiest most disgusting, salacious, lewd, and arousing stuff that will appeal to the rude and the uncouth, and the ever-hypercritical raw sex addicted, stroke pricks/palm-and-fingering sluts. And for a smart person who reads it to feel afterwards as if they have in fact just spent the morning in a Milan or Dubai, Dornbracht 'gentle presentation of water' luxury spa...

And for a less smart person to miss altogether seeing the passcode to get behind that red velvet rope...

I sometimes learn and steal and cheat from those who write just the raw stuff.

But then, I also put it to the test in real life and find out what actually works and in what ways it does.

Yes, I am like those men who look at ANY woman or a sexual being and think - well, I can bang that. But then, the reason I do is not because I want to have conquests or just have sex - it's because I see what is unique about each person that I can see special attractive qualities in and I want to go on beyond just 'a generic sex act,' to explore the unique facets of that person. If I don't see those unique facets, that person is not sexually attractive to me no matter what the common popular view is.

And it is also in those unique personal facets of that individual, that might lie the territory that can take a story beyond the mechanical, generic, sex incident within a clearly erotic story.

Best,

D.
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Old 11-20-2012, 01:06 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sun_sea_sky View Post
The story that I wrote, that I like the most (not everyone agrees, it is currently 4.29) had the main characters not having sex at all, and indeed only one actual fuck in the entire story. The whole thing was the build-up, you thought "will they, won't they?".

I can think of quite a few TV shows, movies, etc. where the whole thing is sexual tension, and the movie ends just before they "do it", although you know now, they probably will.

Is that erotic? Not sure. Romantic, maybe.

Some of the stories here, by other authors, that I like the most are where the sex is late in the story, and then fairly brief, as if the tension is still there. Whereas the stories like "I noticed my sister had big tits so I fucked her senseless for the next year" don't make a heap of sense to me.
As much as SEX, Conflict, and avoidance can be asked - you got yer answer.

A truly GOOD answer, btw. One from the less repetitious.

(When it comes to sex? Don't)
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Last edited by XXplorher : 11-20-2012 at 01:12 AM.
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Old 11-20-2012, 02:42 AM   #35
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I use sex scenes as part of my plots, but at the same time I avoid letting the sex overwhelm the main story. A great story has many twists and turns, and a sex scene can be part of that when you use it wisely like a chef knows how to use spice - just the right amount and you get a great dish - too little and it doesn't taste good, yet too much and the spice overwhelms the flavors that it was supposed to merely enhance.
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