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Here are some things I have been working on, and hopefully you'll enjoy them, and/or give me some constructive feedback.

The first is a hyco:

And the second poem I wrote is this:

welcome to the forum, skimmyskim! feel free to jump in wherever you like with opinions, reviews, and absurdities

your first poem here is a no-bones-about it piece. short and direct it addresses urgency quite neatly. the single lines used for pump each time work to stress the word's brevity mirroring its action.

your second piece holds some original (to my eyes) phrasing here:

Breathing clouds around the hedges of her
Gleaming hazel eyes
sweat steaming on the cusp of her petite-

I'm a big fan of imagery. And sound. Would you say you chose that particular formatting to enhance the concept of romantic for this piece? It probably works as well without the centering. Of course, a lot depends on your target audience. If you were writing this for some women's magazines, for example, they tend to like this sort of layout. For me, it's important the words can stand alone first and foremost. Layout is secondary to that concern, but can amplify the nature of a piece if chosen wisely.

I enjoyed reading this even though your use of the word intertwined made my teeth itch

Nice opener!

First poem, I like the simple directness that matches the subject, without being crude.

Second one......Gorgeous!

*Waiting with stuttering breath for the next installment.....*

I like the first poem a lot. I like that they are centered.
I would think about getting rid of the word And in the second poem.
What's a hyco?

Very much liked he second poem....
Beautiful imagery.


"Hyco" ?.... Haiku - possibly ?

The second poem uses interesting fresh imagery showing sensuous human experience, but what is the poem about?

chipbutty said:

welcome to the forum, skimmyskim! feel free to jump in wherever you like with opinions, reviews, and absurdities

your first poem here is a no-bones-about it piece. short and direct it addresses urgency quite neatly. the single lines used for pump each time work to stress the word's brevity mirroring its action.

your second piece holds some original (to my eyes) phrasing here:

Breathing clouds around the hedges of her
Gleaming hazel eyes
sweat steaming on the cusp of her petite-

I'm a big fan of imagery. And sound. Would you say you chose that particular formatting to enhance the concept of romantic for this piece? It probably works as well without the centering. Of course, a lot depends on your target audience. If you were writing this for some women's magazines, for example, they tend to like this sort of layout. For me, it's important the words can stand alone first and foremost. Layout is secondary to that concern, but can amplify the nature of a piece if chosen wisely.

I enjoyed reading this even though your use of the word intertwined made my teeth itch

Click to expand...

The way it formatted brings a sense of breathlessness of the actions happening. By fragmenting phrases you get this almost out of breath kind of feeling that makes you supposed to feel as if your making love. I believe, though, that format can carry a poem, and that sometimes, its not necessarily the words as so much as it is how it is formatted that brings a point across. Changing the format, can in my opinion, drastically change the meaning of a poem of done right.

And as for imagery, I wanted to be subtle about the things I said. At once erotic and sexual, without being crude. BY doing so I hoped to bring out the more romanitc tones of this poem.

Thanks guys, and does anyone have anything to give me in terms of constructive criticism? I want someone to tell me what was wrong with it, what i can do to improve it, or what i can do better in another poem like this?
THanks so much!

skimmyskim said:

Here are some things I have been working on, and hopefully you'll enjoy them, and/or give me some constructive feedback.

The first is a hyco:

Pump
Her hands on my shaft
Smoldering eyes, hush lips, baby
Swiftly up and down
pump​

And the second poem I wrote is this:

I romanced her,
Wrapped up in the frigid night
Breathing clouds around the hedges of her
Gleaming hazel eyes
sweat steaming on the cusp of her petite-
We lay, lips locked
On the glowing, crimson sheets
Laid tender by the moons aura.
She lay purring, pink, fingers intertwined
And,
She whispered words ancient,
Primal, into my ears.
She is warm.
"Are you real?" I asked,
As she faded with the exhale of my chest,
Her lingering taste,
Fizzling and dissolving on my tongue.​

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The first line of the second poem is throwaway. It's the Nike adage, just do it. Don't tell us what you're doing, show us. "Petite" as in a piece of clothing? It's not descriptive enough. What's the significance of 'crimson sheets'? After 'intertwined', which I don't like either, you have an unnecessary change in syntax: 'She' thru 'ears'. "And" doesn't work as a line. "exhale of my chest" reads awkward.

Hyco -- haiku variant?

I couldn't find out what a hyco was either although I googled it.

In your second poem why do some of your lines start with capital letters and some don't? Best to stick to one or the other, although I always think unless there is fullstop (period to non brits!) lower case is better as it flows as a continuation of the sentence. I got stuck on 'cusp of her petite' too ..... petite what? figure? pussy? Is entwined any better than intertwined? I agree lose the 'and'. I get the feeling she is a succubus (is that male or female I forget?) whatever the female version anyway.
Oh and welcome to the mad bad world of Lit poetry pleased to meet you I am Annie one of the few English around here

Let me make a few very general comments about your poems:

• As others have asked, and you have ignored, I have to ask, what is a "hyco?" I googled the term and found a lake, a shooting club, and various industrial companies. Since you've said that "The first is a hyco", it would help to know what that means before commenting on the poem.
  
  I'm not trying to be combative about this, but I can't really comment on it without knowing what you mean by that term.
  .
• You've centered both poems. Is there a reason for that? I can't see one in the texts, other than perhaps you think it looks better on the screen, which isn't (in my opinion only, of course) a good reason for non-traditional formatting. Are you trying to convey something with that? If so, it isn't clear to me, and the formatting ends up being difficult to read and kind of irritating.
  
  But I know a lot of people like centered formatting, so decide for yourself whether that comment has any merit for you or not. (Like, well, any of these comments, of course.)
  
  I like to think specialized formatting (i.e., formatting that is not left-justified--don't care myself about line caps or not, so long as you're consistent) requires the poet to have some aesthetic reason for the special format. Doing it just to do it seems not to add anything to the poem.
  
  I can't see in these poems what it is doing. Very possibly me, of course, being dense. Your decision as author, anyway.
  
  Just a comment.
  .
• One word lines. Unwise, unless you really know what you're doing.
  
  I'll skip your first poem here, since you seem (at least to me) to be trying some kind of echo effect, with the repeated single word "pump." But that single line "And," in the second poem? What is that supposed to tell me?
  
  The line is a very important component of a poem. That line (for me, anyway) basically contributes nothing to the poem.

I know this kind of sounds like I'm just ragging on you about your poems and I am, a bit. Don't mean anything bad by that, just trying to be honest about things that seem particularly wrong to me. But that is just me, how I have read the poem, and others may read you differently.

Anyway, my comments. If they help, good. If they don't, drift them.

Tzara said:

Let me make a few very general comments about your poems:

• As others have asked, and you have ignored, I have to ask, what is a "hyco?" I googled the term and found a lake, a shooting club, and various industrial companies. Since you've said that "The first is a hyco", it would help to know what that means before commenting on the poem.
  
  I'm not trying to be combative about this, but I can't really comment on it without knowing what you mean by that term.
  .
• You've centered both poems. Is there a reason for that? I can't see one in the texts, other than perhaps you think it looks better on the screen, which isn't (in my opinion only, of course) a good reason for non-traditional formatting. Are you trying to convey something with that? If so, it isn't clear to me, and the formatting ends up being difficult to read and kind of irritating.
  
  But I know a lot of people like centered formatting, so decide for yourself whether that comment has any merit for you or not. (Like, well, any of these comments, of course.)
  
  I like to think specialized formatting (i.e., formatting that is not left-justified--don't care myself about line caps or not, so long as you're consistent) requires the poet to have some aesthetic reason for the special format. Doing it just to do it seems not to add anything to the poem.
  
  I can't see in these poems what it is doing. Very possibly me, of course, being dense. Your decision as author, anyway.
  
  Just a comment.
  .
• One word lines. Unwise, unless you really know what you're doing.
  
  I'll skip your first poem here, since you seem (at least to me) to be trying some kind of echo effect, with the repeated single word "pump." But that single line "And," in the second poem? What is that supposed to tell me?
  
  The line is a very important component of a poem. That line (for me, anyway) basically contributes nothing to the poem.

I know this kind of sounds like I'm just ragging on you about your poems and I am, a bit. Don't mean anything bad by that, just trying to be honest about things that seem particularly wrong to me. But that is just me, how I have read the poem, and others may read you differently.

Anyway, my comments. If they help, good. If they don't, drift them.

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Nono. I appreciate it. It is constructive because you state exactly what you did not like about it, instead of a juvenile response; a rude response just for the sake of being rude.

As for the hyco, haiku thing, it was simply a misspelling on my part; It was how I thought it was spelled. I meant, haiku.

As for the justification of text, the first one, center justification of a haiku is common when a haiku is written in English. Usually, if written in Japanese, which the haiku is, its usually one line.

For the second text, I don't think there is a concrete reason for why it was to be center justified. It could just as easily have been left or right justified, but those could have easily been seen as having another reason; by this I mean left justification isn't necessarily default. My feeling, though, is that a left justication would be better suited for this text simply because of the fragmented way the phrases are written; centered justification seems too neat.

I say "the cusp of her" instead of saying "the cusp of her [pussy]" or the "cusp of her [curves]" because of two things: 1.) Finishing the idea with a noun is cliche; its too usual of a poem, too expected 2.) going along with that, a poem is supposed to allow interpretation, as well speak volumes without being direct. Most good literature (though there are exceptions) isn't just a simple "This is how it is" and frank. It allows the reader to let the imagination run wild, to fill in the blanks with their own thinking into what the author has already guided them to think of. Symbolism, innuendo, etc. It may as very well have been "pussy" or "tits" but I think that's really boring, and in this situation a bit too clandestine. Another way to see my reasoning, is that in the breathless moment of sex, sometimes words just escape the mind, as it would be in the speaker of the poem. Sometimes the thing itself being spoken about, speaks more volumes than the words used to describe it. I would argue that the word "petite" is adequate enough, especially if the broken phrase is supposed to imply something rather than just saying it. I will have to signify this uncomplete line with something, though, maybe a dash or something?

As for the first line, yes, I really need to get rid of that. Especially in the face of what I said in the previous paragraph. Too cliche; nono! There's no reasoning for the "and", so I'm taking that out too. As for the "crimson" sheets, I think that has to do with imagery. It serves its purpose in giving the poem images, and something to visual and see. As for capitalization, I realized that i had no reasoning for it. Although, I want to change the capitalization to group certain phrase together ie, using capitalization to show where ideas begin and end without the aid of a period.

As for change of syntax after the "and" section, i wanted to call the reader's attention to it. It's a way to show that the course of the poem is about to change, calling the reader to pay attention and not be so much in the moment. It heralds the unexpected, bitter twist of the ending, that the lover I am with may not necessarily be real (I say necessarily too much, lol)

Herm, anything else guys? And I like the biting feedback I'm getting. This is the only way I can get better. Thank you so much, and don't be afraid of sounding mean. As long as its not a "your poem sucks, in every way", I think its constructive. And thanks for welcoming me to the forums.

Well I'm glad we sorted out the hyco/haiku thing although I am pretty sure that's not a haiku. Tzara will know more about that than me, but I thought a haiku was supposed to be a brief moment in time without loads of description.

The other thing you say about your second poem that worries me ..... fill in the blanks as you see fit?! Well that would make an interesting challenge if anyone sees fit to post one but I'm not sure it works in a serious poem. Perhaps I read it wrong but if we are to see ourselves what you mean I do think you have to find the right noun whether it's clichéd or not.

UnderYourSpell said:

Well I'm glad we sorted out the hyco/haiku thing although I am pretty sure that's not a haiku. Tzara will know more about that than me, but I thought a haiku was supposed to be a brief moment in time without loads of description.

The other thing you say about your second poem that worries me ..... fill in the blanks as you see fit?! Well that would make an interesting challenge if anyone sees fit to post one but I'm not sure it works in a serious poem. Perhaps I read it wrong but if we are to see ourselves what you mean I do think you have to find the right noun whether it's clichéd or not.

Click to expand...

I think you either oversimplified my argument and/or I did not explain myself well enough. I don't outright say it because I'm guiding the reader, so that the word's preceding will be more than enough. Like I said before, saying but, not outright saying it. I'm not just leaving it up to chance; the reader will have this mental image in their heads, guided by what was said in that line. And no, I don't see that as dangerous at all. We make interpretations as we see fit. Hell, we do that all the time in English classes.

As for haiku, the usual format is three phrases, the first 5 syllables, second 7, third: 5. just wiki it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

skimmyskim said:

I think you either oversimplified my argument and/or I did not explain myself well enough. I don't outright say it because I'm guiding the reader, so that the word's preceding will be more than enough. Like I said before, saying but, not outright saying it. I'm not just leaving it up to chance; the reader will have this mental image in their heads, guided by what was said in that line. And no, I don't see that as dangerous at all. We make interpretations as we see fit. Hell, we do that all the time in English classes.

As for haiku, the usual format is three phrases, the first 5 syllables, second 7, third: 5. just wiki it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

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Did I say it was dangerous?

It's not the syllable count I was contending we have plenty of threads on here already pointing out the whys and wherefores ..... I just thought the content wasn't right but who am I to say *wanders off and keeps opinions to myself*

How to Write Haiku: Moving Beyond 5-7-5

That's all I'm saying.

skimmyskim said:

...

As for haiku, the usual format is three phrases, the first 5 syllables, second 7, third: 5. just wiki it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

Click to expand...

17 syllables arranged over 3 lines in the 5/7/5 format is basic but used by many, especially as it's the most common interpretation offered to school children.

we know that the idea of japanese syllables doesn't translate directly into our own language, but many can and do use forms more akin to the native japanese styling - 17 syllables or less arranged over one to three lines and where beats per line often having more bearing than actual syllabic count. (Having said that, the 'count' in Japanese was very precise.)

what you have here is most definitely not a haiku. haikus address emotional states using images and concepts far more closely related to Nature than the interactions of people, and (when laid out in the 5/7/5 format) tend to comprise of two entirely separate images united by the third line (if I remember rightly) in a way one might not have expected. There's a 'turning point', often found at the end of line 2 and the obligatory reference to a season. They are small and, when crafted well, are polished little gems that look deceptively simplistic - moments captured that manage to make us look at the familiar in a new light.

I understand about breaking the rules of form if it benefits a write, and whilst not slating your first poem of the post it bears as little resemblance to a haiku as a bear does to a budgie. In my opinion.

The pieces that deal with the physicality of humans, and the humourous aspects of life as seen through the eyes of the author are not Haiku but Tanka and Renga, which permit the author/s far more space in which to explore ideas and themes.

skimmyskim said:

I think you either oversimplified my argument and/or I did not explain myself well enough. I don't outright say it because I'm guiding the reader, so that the word's preceding will be more than enough. Like I said before, saying but, not outright saying it. I'm not just leaving it up to chance; the reader will have this mental image in their heads, guided by what was said in that line. And no, I don't see that as dangerous at all. We make interpretations as we see fit. Hell, we do that all the time in English classes.

As for haiku, the usual format is three phrases, the first 5 syllables, second 7, third: 5. just wiki it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

Click to expand...

I don't think you read the definitions for Haiku in that article. Your poem has nothing to do with traditional or really modern haiku. Haiku are nature based poems, usually referencing a season, popular myth, pretty much anything but a sex act. Your 'pump' markers are unnecessary, as you say the hand is moving swiftly up and down the shaft. The poem's actually 1-5-8-5-1 syllables, so it doesn't even meet the most generic definition of haiku.

LadynStFreknBed said:

How to Write Haiku: Moving Beyond 5-7-5

That's all I'm saying.

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you are far more efficient than I

UnderYourSpell said:

Did I say it was dangerous?

It's not the syllable count I was contending we have plenty of threads on here already pointing out the whys and wherefores ..... I just thought the content wasn't right but who am I to say *wanders off and keeps opinions to myself*

Click to expand...

don't you dare

they are all we have to express our voice in a world of silent text

chipbutty said:

17 syllables arranged over 3 lines in the 5/7/5 format is basic but used by many, especially as it's the most common interpretation offered to school children.

we know that the idea of japanese syllables doesn't translate directly into our own language, but many can and do use forms more akin to the native japanese styling - 17 syllables or less arranged over one to three lines and where beats per line often having more bearing than actual syllabic count. (Having said that, the 'count' in Japanese was very precise.)

what you have here is most definitely not a haiku. haikus address emotional states using images and concepts far more closely related to Nature than the interactions of people, and (when laid out in the 5/7/5 format) tend to comprise of two entirely separate images united by the third line (if I remember rightly) in a way one might not have expected. There's a 'turning point', often found at the end of line 2 and the obligatory reference to a season. They are small and, when crafted well, are polished little gems that look deceptively simplistic - moments captured that manage to make us look at the familiar in a new light.

I understand about breaking the rules of form if it benefits a write, and whilst not slating your first poem of the post it bears as little resemblance to a haiku as a bear does to a budgie. In my opinion.

The pieces that deal with the physicality of humans, and the humourous aspects of life as seen through the eyes of the author are not Haiku but Tanka and Renga, which permit the author/s far more space in which to explore ideas and themes.

Click to expand...

What most people don't follow is the link of haiku to cultural myth and symbol. The haiku are almost tiny hypertexts for the native reader. English haiku and the English language can't possibly contain as much culturally relevant information as the Japanese language in the same given space.

haiku by Matsuo Basho.
Furuike ya 5 (Fu-ru-i-ke-ya) An old pond ...
Kawazu tobikomu 7 (Ka-wa-zu-to-bi-ko-mu) A frog jumps in
Mizu no oto 5 (Mi-zu-no-o-to) The sound of water

"Kawazu (frog)" is a kigo that symbolizes spring.

http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/japanese/haiku/saijiki/index.html

Reality is ever changing

LadynStFreknBed said:

How to Write Haiku: Moving Beyond 5-7-5

That's all I'm saying.

Click to expand...

So, whatever the merits of Pump . . . Pump, it is not a Haiku. Perhaps it can be classified as a new poetic form called the Hyco.

Now, just to make the distinction clear, remember that a Haiku is like a photograph that captures an instant in eternity and relates to nature and the seasons, whereas a Hyco is like a movie loop that captures an event stretching a little beyond a moment, divorces it from the stream of time, and turns it into a repeating rhythmic action that relates to humans immersed in their driven natures. Both the Haiku and the Hyco produce some of their artistic effect by fetishizing real time into mental artifacts for contemplation.

The Hyco may also increase endorphin levels more than a Haiku is likely to do.

On looking at the forms we have been doing for Survivor this does seem to lean more towards the Tanka but your thinking it was a Haiku is forgiveable as I had no idea myself about any of the Japanese forms before I came on here and after all we all have to learn through our mistakes and try and get closer to the true form next time.
If he had still been around Senna would have put us all right in no uncertain terms!

UnderYourSpell said:

On looking at the forms we have been doing for Survivor this does seem to lean more towards the Tanka but your thinking it was a Haiku is forgiveable as I had no idea myself about any of the Japanese forms before I came on here and after all we all have to learn through our mistakes and try and get closer to the true form next time.
If he had still been around Senna would have put us all right in no uncertain terms!

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He's around, I'm certain of that. Probably just waiting for his name to be whispered. He has to be conjured, you know, like a magic jinni out of 1001 Nights.

Epmd607 said:

He's around, I'm certain of that. Probably just waiting for his name to be whispered. He has to be conjured, you know, like a magic jinni out of 1001 Nights.

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Well I've asked him to come out once earlier this is twice ..... does it have to be three times like in Beetlejuice?

UnderYourSpell said:

Well I've asked him to come out once earlier this is twice ..... does it have to be three times like in Beetlejuice?

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I think he's Polish, so you might have to offer some halupki before you get your three wishes.