Shame and Humiliation

Hut hut!

Hike! Dammit! Hike!

Careful, this could turn into a scrum...

Rugby sex? I could definitely get into that, mud and all. Hmmm, should we invite Stella?

Clothing optional, right?

Optional? T'heck with that. Clothing forbidden!!

dr_mabeuse said:

The paradigm I'm thinking of in all these examples is the seduction of someone you've had your eye on for a long time -- someone you've really wanted. Someone you want to impress and say something special to with your lovemaking. Or maybe that's just me. Maybe I'm the only one who wants to impress someone by being a good lover.

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No, I really doubt that. I think the impulse is best resisted, though. What? Why would I say a thing like that? It's because if you're focused on trying to be a good lover, then your love-making is about YOU, about your ego, your pride. If you focus on your lover, chances are you'll be a good lover, but the focus will be on her, and you'll be caught up in the moment and participating, not watching yourself and judging. Being fully present in the moment is way more sexy than the very best technique, in my opinion.

You're competing with each other to give pleasure. You're competing to take what you want as well. Someone's going to come first. You want it to be her. That's selfish. Sometimes you're giving and you want it to be you. You're competing for control, to maintain control of yourself and not turn into a sexual beast before she does. You're both trying to drive each other out of your minds, so that's a competition. What else is it?

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*sigh* *hug* Driving each other out of your minds sounds like a lovely idea. Doing it as a competition seems weird to me -- how can you be passionate if part of you is keeping score? The best sex I ever had was with a man who was very adept at turning into a sexual beast, and his doing so ramped up my sexuality, and my ramping up ramped up his, and off we went, to an out-of-our-minds experience. I've also had a controlled, watchful lover who was very careful not to lose it, so as to stay in control of everything. He was so technically excellent that he was fun, but he couldn't match the sheer passion of beastman -- I usually felt like a project with him, and project is not sexy.

I don't play nice and I don't take turns. It's ropes and whips and biting and scratching with me; man vs. woman, struggling for dominance, trying to shame each other with pleasure and see how much they can take. Now maybe that makes me a sick fuck but I don't care. That's the way sex is for me, hot and wild and passionate, half love and half fight, and that's way I want it.

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Whips and biting and scratching are three of my favorite things, and I've never called you a sick fuck. I'm just suggesting that things might be even hotter and more passionate if you weren't keeping score, if you were participating, rather than performing.

Being a great lover is a skill that developes over time. I like to think of myself as a great lover who both focuses on her lover's desires and loses herself in the moment. One is not exclusive of the other, IMO.

AllardChardon said:

Being a great lover is a skill that developes over time. I like to think of myself as a great lover who both focuses on her lover's desires and loses herself in the moment. One is not exclusive of the other, IMO.

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But if you're focusing on your lover's desires, you're not focusing on you, on how you're doing, on if you're being great, are you?

Any trained athlele can perform their required task without thought of the mechanics, only the goal in mind. And sporting is what we are talking about here. IMO, of course.

All great athletes share heart, and a love of the game.

Yes, that is what Doc was driving at, the love of the game between the sexes or between the sex, as the case may be.

A freind of mine always insisted that the relationship between the sexes is fundamentally adversarial - I always envied those relationships where that sort of strain is absent.

I haven't yet figured out whether that's because they have accepted that it's adversarial or have decided mutually to pretend that it isn't.

Cheers.

I had an adversarial relationship and that was enough for me. No more. Being a single person is not necessarily the best scenario, but it beats the hell out of being in a bad relationship.

All relationships are adversarial to some extent. Sex is only one thing out of many that get bumped when two people try to live together for years and years.

The trick is in how the people involved, work to solve things when they arise. Saying "You women, or men, are all alike" is a very popular way to shift the onus, so you get to ignore the individual. I sometimes think that's one of the strengths of same-sex marriages; He can't get away with saying to Him; "You just don't understand men!"

There are a lot of other things they can hurl at each other, of course.

Corylea said:

No, I really doubt that. I think the impulse is best resisted, though. What? Why would I say a thing like that? It's because if you're focused on trying to be a good lover, then your love-making is about YOU, about your ego, your pride. If you focus on your lover, chances are you'll be a good lover, but the focus will be on her, and you'll be caught up in the moment and participating, not watching yourself and judging. Being fully present in the moment is way more sexy than the very best technique, in my opinion.




*sigh* *hug* Driving each other out of your minds sounds like a lovely idea. Doing it as a competition seems weird to me -- how can you be passionate if part of you is keeping score? The best sex I ever had was with a man who was very adept at turning into a sexual beast, and his doing so ramped up my sexuality, and my ramping up ramped up his, and off we went, to an out-of-our-minds experience. I've also had a controlled, watchful lover who was very careful not to lose it, so as to stay in control of everything. He was so technically excellent that he was fun, but he couldn't match the sheer passion of beastman -- I usually felt like a project with him, and project is not sexy.





Whips and biting and scratching are three of my favorite things, and I've never called you a sick fuck. I'm just suggesting that things might be even hotter and more passionate if you weren't keeping score, if you were participating, rather than performing.

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You think about it too much. I don't keep score. i tend to be a dom. I look to be in charge, so I compete to be in charge. I can't help it.

No offense, but the last thing I want is someone telling me how to make love.

Corylea said:

AllardChardon said:

Being a great lover is a skill that developes over time. I like to think of myself as a great lover who both focuses on her lover's desires and loses herself in the moment. One is not exclusive of the other, IMO.

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But if you're focusing on your lover's desires, you're not focusing on you, on how you're doing, on if you're being great, are you?

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You must have missed the part about "losing herself in the moment" - that sounds good to me - it is not wrong to be selfish, to focus on your needs, nobody like to think they disappointed their lover, but that cuts both ways: if you are so selfish as to be inattentive, then that might not be a good thing either - granted, these are generalities, and individual mileage may vary.

For the most part, I have no problem with working a bit to get my lover to come so hard she passes out, I get more sleep that way, and one way or another, I'm going to get off, it's a given, just try to stop me.

i.e., even the worst sex Ive ever had was still pretty good, and the worst ones are probably the ones that are the most selfish: i.e., they don't want to mess up their hair and makeup.

Of course, that could be seen as being too selfless as well, i.e., "just get it over with" - fuck that, I'll just jack off if that your attitude - if you really cared, you could at least pretend to be having a good time - no?

Not that this has ever happened to me, you understand.

xssve said:

i.e., even the worst sex Ive ever had was still pretty good, and the worst ones are probably the ones that are the most selfish: i.e., they don't want to mess up their hair and makeup.

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You might consider not coming onto her in the coat closet at the opera, then!

dr_mabeuse said:

You think about it too much.

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Smartest damned thing I've heard on this thread yet. Generally speaking.

Selena_Kitt said:

You might consider not coming onto her in the coat closet at the opera, then!

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Shoot, that's the best place!

xssve said:

Shoot, that's the best place!

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alright alright, but quit acting like her hair is the reins and yelling out, "Yeeehaaaaaaaaw!"

What a lively group this morning.

I have to say, XssVe, I think your AV is offensive. But you knew that when you put it up. I guess when you say snatch, you mean snatch, huh?

I will endure it but IT leaves a very sour taste in my mouth...

AllardChardon said:

What a lively group this morning.

I have to say, XssVe, I think your AV is offensive. But you knew that when you put it up. I guess when you say snatch, you mean snatch, huh?

I will endure it but IT leaves a very sour taste in my mouth...

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Mine as well and I am a great fan of surrealism. Bleagh!

dr_mabeuse said:

You think about it too much. I don't keep score. i tend to be a dom. I look to be in charge, so I compete to be in charge. I can't help it.

No offense, but the last thing I want is someone telling me how to make love.

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"You sick fuck!"

I have to say, XssVe, I think your AV is offensive. But you knew that when you put it up. I guess when you say snatch, you mean snatch, huh?

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Allard, what browser do you use? If you don't have firefox, I strongly suggest you get it, and add the adblocker plus option. You can rightclick on xssve's little bit of viciousness and presto, he's avless.

AllardChardon said:

What a lively group this morning.

I have to say, XssVe, I think your AV is offensive. But you knew that when you put it up. I guess when you say snatch, you mean snatch, huh?

I will endure it but IT leaves a very sour taste in my mouth...

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I thought it might get mixed reviews, but it really made me laugh when I saw it.

How about this one <-- ?

xssve said:

I thought it might get mixed reviews, but it really made me laugh when I saw it.

How about this one <-- ?

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That one is fine with me, it's not a comment on the essential nature of women.

Kinda sexy, actually, I've played with piercings before. They make the wearer awfully sensitive!

Edited again to ask; Where did you find that picture? She has such an elongated clit-- I wonder if she's been taking testosterone?